Official 400EC thread

h_gerry said:

Sorry to hear about that (particularly because I have the same boat).

My 2 cents are:
1. It could be a serious problem. The stringers are like the studs in the wall supporting the house. If the stringer is rotted, the fiberglass bottom has no support structure behind it. A hard hit or increased flexing over time could weaken the fiberglass hull that could lead to cracks or a rupture.

2. I have not heard of this issue on our boats and don't remember seeing any other posts about rot in the stringer on this thread or the 400DA-410DA/400EC-410EC thread.

3. I can imagine that a repair of a stringer that runs past the engine room bulkhead into the cabin is not going to be cheap.

If it was me, I would want to get a 'second opinion' from a surveyor I know and trust and see what they find. I would not go to the boat yard/repair shop just yet until I confirm there is a problem.

Curious, does the paint on your stringer look in good shape? Any signs that water could be getting in anywhere? How does the stringer look in the area near the sump pump and by the bilge pump under the cabin entry stairs?

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Thanks! I hadn't thought about getting a second opinion but that sounds like a good idea.

Moved the 400 to a different slip in the newer section of the marina. So HAPPY!!

Old slip...


...newer slip

"Newbe question" - hopefully someone can tell me where the breakers / fuses are for a 1994 400 EC. ( or help with my problem.)
All my outlets were working - then tried to turn on the TV last night it was dead along with the master bedroom outlet and TV, second stateroom, and behind the couch. The one below and to the right of the sink (GFCI) is working, the one on the wall up to the right of the sink also works. I've looked around obvious places to no luck. . . probably (hopefully) just missed it.

Thanks

Nick Hahn said:

Kind of the same question here - I have a switch for "power vent" but cannot find any "powered vents" in the boat?

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On my 1994 400EC there are two power vents that exhaust air from the interior directly outdoors through dedicated cowl covers on the port side. One is in the galley over the cooktop, the other is in the head, inside the shower enclosure. The power vent in the galley is operated by one of the two black switches to the left of the cooktop, and exhausts through the rear-most small white triangular cowl cover on the port side of the hull (if it trips a breaker when you flip the switch, your blower motor is probably siezed). The one in the head is inside the shower enclosure, and exhausts through the forward-most small white triangular cowl cover on the port side hull. It is operated by one of the two black switches under the medicine cabinet/mirror.

Air O'Nautical said:

Yes but, your not going to like the answer........

You need to replace the entire track assembly because the newer “trucks” are larger that the old ones.
Fpmarine has rails and trucks avail to make the switch.

Thinking a 3D printer could possibly reproduce the original plastic ones but, that’s outside of my skill-set.

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I'm not sure what year you are looking for parts for, but I have a 1994 400EC. The companion door glides can be ordered as a kit from Pompenette (I believe they were the original manufacturer?). The kit is part # 601-0005 and includes all 4 trucks for about $60 plus shipping. They also have the small white access hole plugs for about $3 each, part # 40-4059. Lead time is given as about 6 weeks due to COVID, but may be sooner. Pompenette prefers you contact them by phone at (603) 826-5791.

You might check your mounts first...I just recently bought the boat, and ordered the door glide kit a couple weeks ago because the door felt "sloppy" and I assumed they were worn out. With a 6 week lead time, in the meantime I decided to check out the installation. I discovered that all 8 mounting screws were just loose. I tightened them up (be careful, they don't take a lot of torque), shot some white lithium grease in the upper and lower tracks, and it opens and closes smooth as silk with one hand now. When it comes in, I guess I'll keep the glide set for when they REALLY fail LOL

Nick Hahn said:

"Newbe question" - hopefully someone can tell me where the breakers / fuses are for a 1994 400 EC. ( or help with my problem.)
All my outlets were working - then tried to turn on the TV last night it was dead along with the master bedroom outlet and TV, second stateroom, and behind the couch. The one below and to the right of the sink (GFCI) is working, the one on the wall up to the right of the sink also works. I've looked around obvious places to no luck. . . probably (hopefully) just missed it.

Thanks

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Try resetting the GFI outlet in the head. All of the outlets you mentioned are likely on that same circuit.
The other GFI outlet is under the galley counter.

Mikentucky said:

I'm not sure what year you are looking for parts for, but I have a 1994 400EC. The companion door glides can be ordered as a kit from Pompenette (I believe they were the original manufacturer?). The kit is part # 601-0005 and includes all 4 trucks for about $60 plus shipping. They also have the small white access hole plugs for about $3 each, part # 40-4059. Lead time is given as about 6 weeks due to COVID, but may be sooner. Pompenette prefers you contact them by phone at (603) 826-5791.

You might check your mounts first...I just recently bought the boat, and ordered the door glide kit a couple weeks ago because the door felt "sloppy" and I assumed they were worn out. With a 6 week lead time, in the meantime I decided to check out the installation. I discovered that all 8 mounting screws were just loose. I tightened them up (be careful, they don't take a lot of torque), shot some white lithium grease in the upper and lower tracks, and it opens and closes smooth as silk with one hand now. When it comes in, I guess I'll keep the glide set for when they REALLY fail LOL

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Be warned, even though you tightened the screws, they can loosen very quickly. Mine loosen within the first hour of use.

h_gerry said:

Be warned, even though you tightened the screws, they can loosen very quickly. Mine loosen within the first hour of use.

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I redid mine the start of this summer - used "Wedge Lock Washers" from McMaster-Carr - Part Number 91812A427 - haven't had an issue with the door all summer.

Olysan,
I replaced two port stringers in my 1994 400EC when I bought it. Bottom line, I would never do it again. Frankly speaking most boats are wet and the build quality of the Sea Rays, like most, is horrible, one only finds out after you tear into it and see the terrible work. These boats are 26 years old so if there are no cracks in the hull etc. now you'll probably never see any. If its wet, its been wet a long time. On my boat the water ingress was due to several locations not being assembled well and those need to be corrected as well. It took me several years to figure out all the locations, the worst was midship on port side where top half of boat is mated to hull behind rub rail, windshield, and a few other places. Because the workmanship is so bad the water wicks under stringers and bulkheads and saturates the wood. If the boat was built properly this would not be possible. My background is engineering & manufacturing and it is evident that there is a considerable lack of high quality workmanship in these boats, but from conversations and research I've found this to be prevalent in the boat manufacturing world.

I have done considerable research on stringers, the wood, foam, or whatever is used to form the shape of stringers is just the form for the fiberglass and most of the strength comes from proper layup of the resin and fiberglass outer shell. I have tons of pictures you can see so you know what you'd be getting into. The materials to do mine 5 years ago was $2000 but I probably had 2000 hours of work...LOL and is was some of the worst, itchy, shitty work I have ever done. You'll have to pull an engine but on a 400 EC its easy, took me 1.5 hours to pull, and about the same to put it back in. If you take good measurements from strategic locations the alignment is a snap when installing and minimal alignment will be required to re-align drive shaft to engine. I cut out the stringers from behind the engine to midway into salon floor, 14 plus ft. I had a marina look at mine when done and they said I did an excellent job. You will also have to cut out the floor in salon and that makes a mess in the boat because it is heavily fiber-glassed as well.

If you are really that concerned, price out the process of drilling holes in stringers and drying the wood inside then filling it with resin. It comes with warranty and is said to be an excellent option $5-$7K as opposed to removing old stringers to repair. Here are a few pictures of mine to give you an idea of what you're looking at. I have the kind of job that let me work on it when I please, if you are only able to work on in in evenings it will take several months to finish.
Most people will back away from wet boats but so many are wet you're better off negotiating with a strong buyer. Find a few reputable companies that epoxy fill wet stringers and get estimates and offer the reduction in price to cover repair.
Good luck!

Mikentucky said:

I'm not sure what year you are looking for parts for, but I have a 1994 400EC. The companion door glides can be ordered as a kit from Pompenette (I believe they were the original manufacturer?). The kit is part # 601-0005 and includes all 4 trucks for about $60 plus shipping. They also have the small white access hole plugs for about $3 each, part # 40-4059. Lead time is given as about 6 weeks due to COVID, but may be sooner. Pompenette prefers you contact them by phone at (603) 826-5791.

You might check your mounts first...I just recently bought the boat, and ordered the door glide kit a couple weeks ago because the door felt "sloppy" and I assumed they were worn out. With a 6 week lead time, in the meantime I decided to check out the installation. I discovered that all 8 mounting screws were just loose. I tightened them up (be careful, they don't take a lot of torque), shot some white lithium grease in the upper and lower tracks, and it opens and closes smooth as silk with one hand now. When it comes in, I guess I'll keep the glide set for when they REALLY fail LOL

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Interested to see if that’s the ones I was told were NLA.

h_gerry said:

Try resetting the GFI outlet in the head. All of the outlets you mentioned are likely on that same circuit.
The other GFI outlet is under the galley counter.

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That did the trick! Thank you.

Air O'Nautical said:

Interested to see if that’s the ones I was told were NLA.

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I tried searching Pompanette's website, but I cannot locate them or see any pictures of them on a google search.

I had a 95 400ec that failed survey due to stringer rot that I found, not the surveyor. Odd right? It was on the port side just rear of the engine mount to the bulkhead. Probably a good 5-6' worth. I've done boat work in the past replacing stringers and it wasn't something I wanted to get into again. I wanted to get in and use it right away. Plus I wasn't getting any sort of deal per say. I walked.

Air O'Nautical said:

Interested to see if that’s the ones I was told were NLA.

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We'll see, or maybe I just spent $60 on incorrect parts I got the numbers and info from a different forum. But it was an owner of a 1994 400EC like mine, he had listed the truck and access hole plug numbers as given to him by Pompanette and used to fix his sliding cabin door.

Like h_gerry and I both found out, he also said the kit was not listed on the Pompanette website--but said when he called and spoke to them in person to see about any replacement parts, someone did some digging and found those original part numbers for him. I'll update this post when the parts come in, whether they were correct or not.

We've just recently joined the "big boat club"--for the past 30 years everything I've owned has been 24' or less, usually mid cabins and no generators. But I finally talked the admiral into moving up to something we could spend a weekend on, something with a wide beam for entertaining...and a couple weeks ago we bought a gently used, well maintained 400EC for a good price and couldn't be happier. For good information, whether it's vehicles, home or boats I'm a big fan of owner forums. Over the past 2 weeks I've read all 50 pages of this 400EC forum as well as several other threads, forums and websites, and hands down Club Sea Ray is the best central information point I've found, especially this 400EC thread. I don't think I've read a post here that wasn't down to earth, friendly without a lot of bickering over petty details, and VERY hands-on useful information...thanks for all the tips, information, ideas and pictures!

I'm a 20 year heavy equipment mechanic by trade as well as a high-rise general maintenance tech for years before that, so I'm not afraid to tackle anything from mechanical to plumbing to electrical...but boy the leap from a small boat with 4 main systems (propulsion, fresh water, electrical distribution and sewage) to basically a 40' floating house is intimidating! After seeing some of the things that COULD go wrong on here (stringer rot and getting an engine block out over that high sideboard are my two worst-imagined scenarios), makes me want to just baby this thing and not turn anything on We didn't have a survey done, there was one on board from about 5 years ago when the PO purchased her. I've spoken to the mechanic who maintained her the past 5 years, and have given her a once-over and found a few relatively minor things I need to work on, but all systems are functional for the most part. The 7.4 EFI closed cooled motors have about 950 hours and have never had any major work; the starboard tranny was rebuilt 2 years ago, port was not; Quicksilver 7.5 genset has 1600 hours, never rebuilt but tuned up last year with carb rebuild and new impeller.

Soooo....all that being said....I've got a couple of questions that I would love to hear "seasoned 400EC" input on.
1) I almost cringe to ask, but on a boat this big are there any things I should check or keep an eye on, just generally or 400EC specific, to catch a minor problem before it becomes a major one? How would I check for stringer rot, and where is the most common spot it would happen on this boat?
2) I've always trailered my boats and pu them in dry winter storage--I'm in KY where the winters can get below freezing for a couple of months. But most of the big boats in my marina say they just leave their boats in and either use bilge heaters or even heat lamps to keep rudder and propshaft hull entry points from freezing--which I would like, because I can work on the boat over the winter What do you guys think about pulling versus leaving in?

Mikentucky said:

We've just recently joined the "big boat club"--for the past 30 years everything I've owned has been 24' or less, usually mid cabins and no generators. But I finally talked the admiral into moving up to something we could spend a weekend on, something with a wide beam for entertaining...and a couple weeks ago we bought a gently used, well maintained 400EC for a good price and couldn't be happier. For good information, whether it's vehicles, home or boats I'm a big fan of owner forums. Over the past 2 weeks I've read all 50 pages of this 400EC forum as well as several other threads, forums and websites, and hands down Club Sea Ray is the best central information point I've found, especially this 400EC thread. I don't think I've read a post here that wasn't down to earth, friendly without a lot of bickering over petty details, and VERY hands-on useful information...thanks for all the tips, information, ideas and pictures!

I'm a 20 year heavy equipment mechanic by trade as well as a high-rise general maintenance tech for years before that, so I'm not afraid to tackle anything from mechanical to plumbing to electrical...but boy the leap from a small boat with 4 main systems (propulsion, fresh water, electrical distribution and sewage) to basically a 40' floating house is intimidating! After seeing some of the things that COULD go wrong on here (stringer rot and getting an engine block out over that high sideboard are my two worst-imagined scenarios), makes me want to just baby this thing and not turn anything on We didn't have a survey done, there was one on board from about 5 years ago when the PO purchased her. I've spoken to the mechanic who maintained her the past 5 years, and have given her a once-over and found a few relatively minor things I need to work on, but all systems are functional for the most part. The 7.4 EFI closed cooled motors have about 950 hours and have never had any major work; the starboard tranny was rebuilt 2 years ago, port was not; Quicksilver 7.5 genset has 1600 hours, never rebuilt but tuned up last year with carb rebuild and new impeller.

Soooo....all that being said....I've got a couple of questions that I would love to hear "seasoned 400EC" input on.
1) I almost cringe to ask, but on a boat this big are there any things I should check or keep an eye on, just generally or 400EC specific, to catch a minor problem before it becomes a major one? How would I check for stringer rot, and where is the most common spot it would happen on this boat?
2) I've always trailered my boats and pu them in dry winter storage--I'm in KY where the winters can get below freezing for a couple of months. But most of the big boats in my marina say they just leave their boats in and either use bilge heaters or even heat lamps to keep rudder and propshaft hull entry points from freezing--which I would like, because I can work on the boat over the winter What do you guys think about pulling versus leaving in?

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Pull the boat if you want to work on it out of the water. Otherwise if the weather is decent, leaving in year round is perfectly acceptable. To check for any wetness or rot, you can use several different methods but some require backup in my opinion. Try using a sounding hammer and listening for a distinct loud ring to indicate good wood. You can also use a moisture meter, however, those results are typically harder to interpret because all boats of your age will show some wetness.

Mikentucky said:

We've just recently joined the "big boat club"--for the past 30 years everything I've ........
Soooo....all that being said....I've got a couple of questions that I would love to hear "seasoned 400EC" input on.
1) I almost cringe to ask, but on a boat this big are there any things I should check or keep an eye on, just generally or 400EC specific, to catch a minor problem before it becomes a major one? How would I check for stringer rot, and where is the most common spot it would happen on this boat?
2) I've always trailered my boats and pu them in dry winter storage--I'm in KY where the winters can get below freezing for a couple of months. But most of the big boats in my marina say they just leave their boats in and either use bilge heaters or even heat lamps to keep rudder and propshaft hull entry points from freezing--which I would like, because I can work on the boat over the winter What do you guys think about pulling versus leaving in?

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Welcome to the 400EC Club!! I have had mine for going on seven seasons now and I can still say I love her! They are great handling boats with a good layout with plenty of room. We have had groups of up to 12+ on board and were not overly crowded. They handle well, but are not speed demons. My only regret is I wish I had found a diesel version. As I have told numerous people, "if my boat was diesel, I would be done."

To answer your questions:
1. Other than normal maintenance items: oil changes, checking fluids, etc., I am not sure what I can offer other than saying, stuff is going to break. At some point you will need to replace or repair something, and sometimes it will be a big something. It is the nature of a boat. Just try to keep looking things over and go with your gut if something just does not look right. Feel free to ask any questions because we have all been there.

2. I am in New York and for the past 3 or 4 years, I have keep my boat in the water all year round. I winterize the systems; fresh water, engines, generator, A/C, etc. and usually have the boat shrink wrapped while in the water. I have a zippered door added to the shrink wrap so I can get into the boat and check on things. I leave the shore power connected and have a heater in the cabin and a bilge-safe heater in the engine room to try to keep things above freezing, just in case. I am lucky that the canal my boat is on typically does not freeze over so I don't need a bubble system or ice-eater. Granted, the boat is in my backyard so keeping an eye on things is pretty simple. I do a spring time short haul for pressure wash, bottom paint and zincs.

(Since I am at work right now, trying to avoid work without success, I need to stop here, but will add more if you need other info)

Mikentucky said:

We've just recently joined the "big boat club"--for the past 30 years everything I've owned has been 24' or less, usually mid cabins and no generators. But I finally talked the admiral into moving up to something we could spend a weekend on, something with a wide beam for entertaining...and a couple weeks ago we bought a gently used, well maintained 400EC for a good price and couldn't be happier. For good information, whether it's vehicles, home or boats I'm a big fan of owner forums. Over the past 2 weeks I've read all 50 pages of this 400EC forum as well as several other threads, forums and websites, and hands down Club Sea Ray is the best central information point I've found, especially this 400EC thread. I don't think I've read a post here that wasn't down to earth, friendly without a lot of bickering over petty details, and VERY hands-on useful information...thanks for all the tips, information, ideas and pictures!

I'm a 20 year heavy equipment mechanic by trade as well as a high-rise general maintenance tech for years before that, so I'm not afraid to tackle anything from mechanical to plumbing to electrical...but boy the leap from a small boat with 4 main systems (propulsion, fresh water, electrical distribution and sewage) to basically a 40' floating house is intimidating! After seeing some of the things that COULD go wrong on here (stringer rot and getting an engine block out over that high sideboard are my two worst-imagined scenarios), makes me want to just baby this thing and not turn anything on We didn't have a survey done, there was one on board from about 5 years ago when the PO purchased her. I've spoken to the mechanic who maintained her the past 5 years, and have given her a once-over and found a few relatively minor things I need to work on, but all systems are functional for the most part. The 7.4 EFI closed cooled motors have about 950 hours and have never had any major work; the starboard tranny was rebuilt 2 years ago, port was not; Quicksilver 7.5 genset has 1600 hours, never rebuilt but tuned up last year with carb rebuild and new impeller.

Soooo....all that being said....I've got a couple of questions that I would love to hear "seasoned 400EC" input on.
1) I almost cringe to ask, but on a boat this big are there any things I should check or keep an eye on, just generally or 400EC specific, to catch a minor problem before it becomes a major one? How would I check for stringer rot, and where is the most common spot it would happen on this boat?
2) I've always trailered my boats and pu them in dry winter storage--I'm in KY where the winters can get below freezing for a couple of months. But most of the big boats in my marina say they just leave their boats in and either use bilge heaters or even heat lamps to keep rudder and propshaft hull entry points from freezing--which I would like, because I can work on the boat over the winter What do you guys think about pulling versus leaving in?

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Mike,
1. It would be very helpful to be on your boat when its raining. Look for leaks in areas at the base of windshield. The black foam on outside bottom can be pulled off and you can re-seal any area's that leak.
2. Leaks in canvas. Any water that flows down the backside of the cockpit panels is going to rot the wood.
3. BIG ONE HERE: Go in bilge and see if it has more water in it after a rain and look for wet areas that could be related to upper/lower hull seam leaks behind the rub rail. From what I am seeing hear one common area is midship port side by radar arch. Look inbetween front of port fuel tank and holding tank, mounted right in front of it. Look for mold in areas of bilge where water is leaking in and stop it. You may have to reseal stainless rubrail on outside around the entire boat and the screws that hold it to hull.
4. Windless motors are famous for buring up. If your's is having a hard time pulling in rope its only a matter of time.
5. Make sure AC condensation lines are not plugged so they drain properly. The shower sump pumps AC condensation overboard so that pump is critical for proper AC drainage. If AC Keypads start acting goofy send it to "Flight Systems" for service or replacmeent. TOP NOTCH company with reasonable prices.
6. Salon/cockpit sliding door lower rollers are problems.
7. Battery charger. Check for functionality and consider getting new smart technology charger. The OEM charger does tend to boil off battery water if you leave it on constantly. Top up batteries 1-2 times a year.
8. ANY vibration in drive system should be check. (Shaft, cutless, prop, alignment, etc.) Last year a good friend of mine lost a prop, broke shaft off right behind cutlass because his shaft was slightly bent.
9. Take extra care if winterizing water system. Hot water heater is burried on starboard side midship and if it freezes and cracks, it will most likely require the starboard engine to be pulled to replace.(Some say it can be replaced without engine pull).. Still a PITA.
10. Front search light drive gears become brittle and crack. NOT a low cost repair.
11. Rudder packings for leakage.
12. Hardware mounted on top of radar arch for leaks. Will fill arch lights or run into engine compartment.
13. If you use generator a lot and the water has a considerable amount of floating debre from trees, in Saugatuck MI we have some kind of pea size pellet that covers the water and will quickly plug up intake for generator. If you see steam coming from gen. exhaust and water is hot to touch its getting plugged.
14. Check the fuel lines for cracks. Mine had the outter rubber cracking and it was making the engine harder to start. (I beleive it reduced the vacuum in line the fuel pump crates to pull fuel, replaced it and engine started easily, plus it is a fire hazard.
15. Dash rocker switch lighting strips burn out and are costly to replace. Install LED lights in stratigic places to re-iluminate. Tie into dimmer.

Thats all for now but I am sure others will add to items to keep an eye on.

Hello, all. I'm new to ClubSeaRay. I'm considering the purchase of a '94 400 EC. One deficiency that's going to come up on the survey is that the aft large white plastic clamshell on the port hullside is missing. Since there should be 2 of those clamshells, I assume that they are for the galley and head vents. There are 3 apparent mounting holes at 120 degree intervals around the large round opening normally covered by the clamshell.

My question: Is it necessary to access the hullside from inside the bilge to mount the clamshells? IF so, is it difficult to get access there? IF not, how's the best way to install the new one? Also, does anyone have a source for these clamshells?

Thanks in advance.

sws01 said:

Hello, all. I'm new to ClubSeaRay. I'm considering the purchase of a '94 400 EC. One deficiency that's going to come up on the survey is that the aft large white plastic clamshell on the port hullside is missing. Since there should be 2 of those clamshells, I assume that they are for the galley and head vents. There are 3 apparent mounting holes at 120 degree intervals around the large round opening normally covered by the clamshell.

My question: Is it necessary to access the hullside from inside the bilge to mount the clamshells? IF so, is it difficult to get access there? IF not, how's the best way to install the new one? Also, does anyone have a source for these clamshells?

Thanks in advance.

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I'm missing my forward one, just ordered it off of E-bay for like $57...it has three "christmas tree" push pins to secure it, no dificult access needed

https://www.ebay.com/itm/SEA-RAY-68...rentrq:ece550971730a9cca7e8ec87ffffd59c|iid:1