Who is a ZF 63 IV expert here? Have a noise

mnm99

mnm99

Well-Known Member
Oct 2, 2015
2,447
Long Island
Boat Info
2004 340 SeaRay Sundancer
Engines
Twin 8.1 Merc
Hey guys. Last winter I replace the trans with a upgraded NEW ZF68 IV. In the video below you can here a squeal sound when put into gear. The sound IS coming from the area where you see the shift handle move. I believe that's the pump. It is not the shaft, a bearing ect. I know this for sure that this is where it is coming from. This ONLY happens from 650rpm to 1050rpm and then goes away. Runs smooth, shifts smooth ect. Took it out for a 3500rpm run and all good. Heading back to the dock still had it. Once I tied up I shut down the engine. Started up 5 min later and sounded much better. Could this just have to break in or is it a line pressure noise since once I blip the throttle it goes right away.

https://youtube.com/shorts/_VusiS-6XAU?feature=share
 
Nevermind, Called ZF. Said it was the relief valve and it will break in. Give it time to seat. Hope it does.
 
KevinC said:
You would think there would be a big warning about that somewhere ?!? I wonder how many people panic when the new tranny squeals.

-Kevin
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Have you heard of this too?
 
has anyone ever here heard this before? I know they said run it, but I took it out yesterday and it’s driving me crazy.
 
mnm99 said:
has anyone ever here heard this before? I know they said run it, but I took it out yesterday and it’s driving me crazy.
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There are two relief valves. The lube pressure relief valve which is simply a steel ball and spring behind one of the plugs on the shift housing and the shift pressure relief valve which the valve body has to be removed to access.
Regardless remove the lube pressure relief valve plug and pull the spring and ball and clean up.
That plug for the lube pressure relief valve is item 14. The shift pressure relief valve is items 20 through 24.
upload_2022-5-14_8-23-7.png
 
ttmott said:
There are two relief valves. The lube pressure relief valve which is simply a steel ball and spring behind one of the plugs on the shift housing and the shift pressure relief valve which the valve body has to be removed to access.
Regardless remove the lube pressure relief valve plug and pull the spring and ball and clean up.
That plug for the lube pressure relief valve is item 14. The shift pressure relief valve is items 20 through 24.
View attachment 126504
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Thanks. From your experience, would either of those cause this problem? The relief valve is what one guy said it MAY be.
 
I listened to this again. To my ear, this sound like the prop is “singing”

When you put it in gear the whine seems to correlate to the shaft starting to spin and then seems to follow the speed of the shaft.

There was a thread on THT about this, and a couple items came up. 1) Have prop reworked. 2) could be from new cutless bearing 3) might be from painting the prop.

Do you have anti foul/prop speed on the props? If so removing might be an easy first step.

https://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-forum/1008231-prop-singing.html
 
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dtfeld said:
I listened to this again. To my ear, this sound like the prop is “singing”

When you put it in gear the whine seems to correlate to the shaft starting to spin and then seems to follow the speed of the shaft.

There was a thread on THT about this, and a couple items came up. 1) Have prop reworked. 2) could be from new cutless bearing 3) might be from painting the prop.

Do you have anti foul/prop speed on the props? If so removing might be an easy first step.

https://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-forum/1008231-prop-singing.html
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It’s has brand new props. Cutless is 1 year old. They are painted with petit spray paint. I used a stethoscope and can hear it the most at the shifter. I will ask my prop shop about the singing.
 
mnm99 said:
It’s has brand new props. Cutless is 1 year old. They are painted with petit spray paint. I used a stethoscope and can hear it the most at the shifter. I will ask my prop shop about the singing.
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I listened to it a couple more times. Does it make the same sound in REV? If it made the same sound in REV, that would lead me to the Trans, but only in FWD, that would lead me to prop singing.

Seems like all new running gear was a factor. That sucks, but hopefully something simple and easily remedied.
 
No only in Forward. Fine in reverse. I’d rather it be a prop issue then trans. Going to call my prop shop Monday and see what they say.
Edit. Now with the stethoscope I can’t pin point it! I don’t know
 
Did you experience this noise from day one with the new transmission or is it something that started later? In what order was the work done, the transmission and props?
 
From day one the boat was in the water. I put it in 2 weeks ago. Unfortunately I replaced the trans, shaft, and props at the same time. ALL BRAND NEW.
 
I don't know if this is a variable but, I experienced whining in one of the transmissions in my last boat, an 02 Cruisers Yachts 3672, which had 8.1 l Crusader engines and ZF transmissions. My yard told me it was a bad trani, so at the end of the season, I pulled both engines, since the other had a bad rear main seal and took the trani to a shop in NJ that rebuilds them.

After tearing it down in front of me, he found that the oil had water in it and somewhat saw normal wear on the plates, a broken tooth on one of the worm gears and said that for the cost of rebuilding it, I could purchase a brand new trani for another $1k (We all know that's what the "T" in boat stands for, right?) Turns out that the gear cooler on that engine was corroded from the inside and cross contaminating the trani. I changed the gear coolers on both engines, purchased a new trani and the boat ran great until I sold it 2-years later!

If you have gear coolers on your boat, have them checked. At least I got to detail my engine room while the engines were out that winter.
 

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mnm99 said:
Cooler is new, no water in oil.
Sure sounds like this

Mine= https://youtube.com/shorts/_VusiS-6XAU?feature=share
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sounds the same to me, I think you have it nailed

any chance of decoupling the shaft and transmission (you’d have to support the shaft through the V drive somehow so it doesn’t rub) and putting it into gear? No load on the engine so it might not be a valid test, but if that leaves no noise it may confirm you’re on the right track

disclaimer is I have no idea if putting a V drive into gear with no load is good or bad so you might want to run that by ZF first
 
Strecker25 said:
sounds the same to me, I think you have it nailed

any chance of decoupling the shaft and transmission (you’d have to support the shaft through the V drive somehow so it doesn’t rub) and putting it into gear? No load on the engine so it might not be a valid test, but if that leaves no noise it may confirm you’re on the right track

disclaimer is I have no idea if putting a V drive into gear with no load is good or bad so you might want to run that by ZF first
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Yea I was thinking about that. Easy enough to do, but will I get the same effect on the trans without a load. I’m not worried about no load on trans. I did run it for a few seconds at home when I installed it with no prop or shaft installed, but it was so quick in gear and out of gear for me to tell. That definitely was quite though from what I remember. Maybe I’ll try it.
 
I just pulled up my scans. When I got them back on the new props I was so excited how perfect they were. Look at the left hand prop (port) Maybe perfect isn't good. LOL. If I find out I'll let you guys know.
SS NEW port prop.jpg
SS NEW Star prop.jpg
 
Got a response back. Along with this there going to send a video to me from one of the mechanice showing where and how to file it. My yard said he'll charge me $50 to haul with the sling so I can file it a little.

Marc,
Yes, this is the propeller singing. Believe it or not, sometimes when the propeller is too perfect it creates this harmonic sound at low RPM. This can be fixed by filing the edge of the blades to create more of a blunt edge. We can do this for you whenever you would like or if you are comfortable doing it yourself that is fine too. Let me know if you have any questions.
 
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