1st boat questions

J

Jbrower157

New Member
Jun 10, 2018
6
Boat Info
Sea ray sundancer 268
Engines
Boatless
Been thinking about getting a boat for awhile. My only real experience has been on my grandfathers boat over the years. He recently called me saying a friend of his is selling an 87 sundancer 268 that’s worth looking at. So I looked at it and went for a quick spin around the bay yesterday. Overall I like it. It definitely needs some work. The teak’s pretty weathered but solid. Seats are in pretty good shape although the rear bench is missing. And the fold downs will probably break off their hinges if you sit on them. The fiberglass looks good also. The only issue the guy was willing to offer up is a bad water heater. No big deal. My only concern is the engine. It’s a 5.7 mercruiser. The second engine with 538 hours. No idea when it was replaced, although the owner said it’s a serpentine belt and the originals weren’t, which he seems to think is a way of dating it. Either way, sounded good at idle. Started immediately. But when he was bringing it up to plane I noticed he was holding at about at 5,000rpm. I asked if that rpm was normal and he brought it down to about 4,500 and said that’s where you wanna be. Once it was on plane he brought it down to 3,000-3500. My grandfather commented to me that he thought 5,000 was a bit much and also wasn’t impressed with the output at 5,000. I’m also a little concerned that he’s only asking $5,000. I see them going for a lot higher on Long Island. Does anyone have any input on the engine? Or anything to look into on this boat specifically?
 

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so, it comes up to 5k rpm right away (still going slow) and stays at 5 till up, then reved down?
 
Over rpm could be as simple as the pitch on the prop or a bad motor coupling or prop hub. Any of these things could cause lack of speed at this RPM. The motor and mechanics are important but I would be more concern with the stringers and transom 5 grand is a drop in the bucket if you find out after buying it that wood structures are rotted and need replaced.
 
Sorry if my terminology’s lacking. I have a lot to learn. When he was bringing it up to speed with the front of the boat up and the rear down it was holding at 5,000rpm. Once it leveled off he brought it down to around 3,000rpm at cruising speed. The boat seemed to be moving pretty well to me. My grandfather seems to think it was lagging a little for 5,000rpm. He says he’s able to bring his boat to plane at 3,500 or less. But I keep in mind my grandfathers boats 23 ft without such a large cabin. I also forgot to mention what else I had some concern about. He said he never covered the boat in the winter. He was taught it was a waist of money or something. He claims snow or water never entered the cabin because the boat was pitched back while in storage. I couldn’t feel any dampness in the carpet. And the boat honestly looks good. But it being exposed all winter makes me skeptical. I know the floor and stringers are foam filled plywood.
 
Happy Dayz said:
so, it comes up to 5k rpm right away (still going slow) and stays at 5 till up, then reved down?
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I don’t know necessarily that it comes to 5,000 right away. I never heard the engine rev out or anything. I’m more concerned that the engine needs to be brought to 5,000 just to get to plane. Unless he was just being hard on it. I’m also curious if holding 5,000 for a few minutes is bad for the engine. Assuming it’s done regularly with this guy.
 
Generally speaking modern 5.7 WOT is 4500-5000 rpm the older engine are 4800 rpm so its not like your over reving those engines that much.The question is it a good practice to run like this all the time the answer would be no .Oil pressure and a compression test will tell you a ton about the health of these engines.For piece of mind that would be a good idea if the stringers and transom checks out.It sounds to me the boat has the wrong props on it and it needs a little more pitch to bring the RPM back into range.The prop info will tell you a lot if it is under pitch this would explain way your seeing such high RPM to get on plane.
 
I think this boat has a single 5.7L.....all the things you have said so far have me leaning towards someone installing a lower pitch prop on the outdrive in the past.....that is a lot of boat for a single 5.7L to push around...a lower pitch prop would help it get on plane faster and would allow the engine to rev up to the max rpm rating (or above)....a lower pitch prop may also make the boat 'seem' to be underperforming at a certain engine rpm.....it would require the engine to be running at a higher rpm to maintain being on plane....

cliff
 
Yeah. That vintage 260 should max at about 4200-4600RPM. i recently switched to a new 15.8x15 prop on our 250 and mac at 4600. But i agree that 260 is going to be a little tough on a 268. really borderline there on needing a bigger engine for that size boat. ours is fine with a 260 but our dry is about 4600lbs, probably 6000 with us, fuel, gear, etc..
 
Thanks for the info guys. I have a good idea of what to look into now. I’m thinking about getting a moisture meter to check the cabin floor. Are they helpful when the boats in the water? I don’t know the depth that they read
 
Look....several people have suggested getting a survey done. Save the money on the moisture meter and find a professional marine surveyor and pay them to survey the boat. The floor isn't the issue. The transom and stringers are what's critical. A survey will cost you a few hundred dollars but either way you will know what you have. The boat is 30+ years old. A boat left uncovered for 30 years is going to have some issues. A survey will let you know what those issues are so you can make an informed decision to buy or to walk away.

Now I'll say what others have said....the 5.7L/260 is just not enough motor for that boat....with any prop. It will always struggle to get on plane and it will work hard to stay there. Increasing the HP on that motor can be done but it is pricey. Plus, the Alpha drive is not very dependable over 300 HP so anything bigger demands a Bravo drive. That swap could run $6-10,000.

Get the survey done. If everything checks out and you can get the boat for $5k or better, less, AND you are OK with the performance....buy the boat. Just remember, the only cost effective way to make a boat go faster is to buy a faster boat.

The 268 is a great boat. You don't say where you are located but there are 15 268s for sale on Yacht World. Of the 15 only a couple have the 260 engine. Most are either 454s or twin 4.3 v-6s. Good luck with whatever you do. I hope it all works out but remember above all....don't get emotional when buying a boat.
Shawn
 
NorCal Boater said:
Look....several people have suggested getting a survey done. Save the money on the moisture meter and find a professional marine surveyor and pay them to survey the boat. The floor isn't the issue. The transom and stringers are what's critical. A survey will cost you a few hundred dollars but either way you will know what you have. The boat is 30+ years old. A boat left uncovered for 30 years is going to have some issues. A survey will let you know what those issues are so you can make an informed decision to buy or to walk away.

Now I'll say what others have said....the 5.7L/260 is just not enough motor for that boat....with any prop. It will always struggle to get on plane and it will work hard to stay there. Increasing the HP on that motor can be done but it is pricey. Plus, the Alpha drive is not very dependable over 300 HP so anything bigger demands a Bravo drive. That swap could run $6-10,000.

Get the survey done. If everything checks out and you can get the boat for $5k or better, less, AND you are OK with the performance....buy the boat. Just remember, the only cost effective way to make a boat go faster is to buy a faster boat.

The 268 is a great boat. You don't say where you are located but there are 15 268s for sale on Yacht World. Of the 15 only a couple have the 260 engine. Most are either 454s or twin 4.3 v-6s. Good luck with whatever you do. I hope it all works out but remember above all....don't get emotional when buying a boat.
Shawn
Click to expand...
 
I spoke to a surveyor and the boat owner. He doesn’t want a survey because he claims the boats solid and it’s a waste of time. All I need to hear. The search continues. Thanks for the help. It’ll be useful for the next one.
 
Jbrower157 said:
I spoke to a surveyor and the boat owner. He doesn’t want a survey because he claims the boats solid and it’s a waste of time. All I need to hear. The search continues. Thanks for the help. It’ll be useful for the next one.
Click to expand...
Smart move.... A seller that won't allow his boat to be inspected or surveyed is afraid of something. Having a boat surveyed is standard practice in the buying process and costs the seller nothing....unless something is found.

Look at Yachtworld and Boat Trader. Yachtworld will be boats for sale by a broker and they are usually a bit more professional and at least understand the process. Enjoy the search and good luck.
Shawn
 
To help clarify the process, as a buyer you determine what terms you want to write into the purchase contract, and the seller can agree to them or not. Since you are making the offer, you get the first swing at writing the terms of the agreement. Having a boat surveyed (and conducting a sea trial) is one of the conditions you would write into the contract. You pay for the survey, but you would generally have the owner operate the boat during the survey and sea trial, so that any damage is the owner's responsibility. As mentioned above, any seller that won't agree to a survey (that you are paying for) is obviously concerned about what the survey will find.

Out of fairness, some people may have a survey and then expect the seller to fix every item found in the survey, which may not be a reasonable expectation given the age of the boat and the selling price. That being said, you are the one who gets to decide if the survey is acceptable, and the contract should say so. if you need examples of a typical purchase contract you can find them online, or just reply here and many of us can provide example.

Regardless of what the seller is comfortable with, if YOU aren't comfortable with the terms of the deal, just walk away. There are lots of boats in the world - you will do well if you don't let your emotions override your common sense on the deal.
 
Wow.. I'd be interested to know what you did? I have a 24 foot 888 and I'm on top at 2500 rpm loaded with people. I almost bought a searay weekender. It had a 350 v8. But the boat is massive. It's a lot of wieght to push . We ride the suwannee river which has a really strong current .you can feel it going upstream or with a headwind. Lots of factors.
 
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