Maybe that was an available upgrade option? The original "Boat Order" for ours is silent on the topic of cockpit/bridge carpet...
-Chris
58 Sedan Bridge Official Thread
- Thread starter Skip
- Start date
Maybe that was an available upgrade option? The original "Boat Order" for ours is silent on the topic of cockpit/bridge carpet...
-Chris
BED LINENS?
Does anyone happen to know OEM supplier for sheets and pillowcases and so forth?
I know I can get sheets lots of places, but we've surprisingly found several complete and apparently new/unused (or at least only lightly used) sets or original sheets/pillowcases. OTOH, we're missing a top sheet for one set and a couple pillow cases for another... and thought it'd be nifty if we could just order some from whoever the OEM supplier was.
Given we have Handcraft Mattresses, they were my first guess... but they said the only did the mattresses, not the bed linens...
-Chris
Does anyone happen to know OEM supplier for sheets and pillowcases and so forth?
I know I can get sheets lots of places, but we've surprisingly found several complete and apparently new/unused (or at least only lightly used) sets or original sheets/pillowcases. OTOH, we're missing a top sheet for one set and a couple pillow cases for another... and thought it'd be nifty if we could just order some from whoever the OEM supplier was.
Given we have Handcraft Mattresses, they were my first guess... but they said the only did the mattresses, not the bed linens...
-Chris
- Mar 25, 2008
- 5,522
- Boat Info
- 2006 Sea Ray 58 DB
- Engines
- MAN CRM V8-900s, Twin Disc Drives; Onan 21.5 Generator
Chris - my 410 had the crumbly black backing, and I got some white silicone mobile home roof coating at Lowe's. Worked like a charm. Black Jack Roof Patch - White elastomeric...$20 a gallon.
missnmountains
Active Member
So an update for all of the 58DB people. A month ago on a somewhat short trip to Southseas, Our steering cylinder sprung a major leak. After our week stay, we tried to leave, but literally had no steering. We had to be towed back 4.5 hours to our house. Thank God for Seatow!
Seastar was sold to Dometic, who sold all of their patents and licenses to Boat Steering Solutions, LLC (BSS, LLC) in North Naples.
My mechanic said he would replace the seals. I purchased $250.00 in seals, reinstalled, and during purging, sprung another leak. Called BSS, LLC, who told me there is a zero percent chance that replacing the seals would fix a leak. The cylinder rack must be remanufactured. Around $1,600.00. I wish they would have said that when I purchased the seal kits.
I took it up to them, and basically after a week received a "new" steering rack.
Purging is a two person job, but is pretty easy.
We are back on the water after a month!!
Ken
Seastar was sold to Dometic, who sold all of their patents and licenses to Boat Steering Solutions, LLC (BSS, LLC) in North Naples.
My mechanic said he would replace the seals. I purchased $250.00 in seals, reinstalled, and during purging, sprung another leak. Called BSS, LLC, who told me there is a zero percent chance that replacing the seals would fix a leak. The cylinder rack must be remanufactured. Around $1,600.00. I wish they would have said that when I purchased the seal kits.
I took it up to them, and basically after a week received a "new" steering rack.
Purging is a two person job, but is pretty easy.
We are back on the water after a month!!
Ken
- Mar 25, 2008
- 5,522
- Boat Info
- 2006 Sea Ray 58 DB
- Engines
- MAN CRM V8-900s, Twin Disc Drives; Onan 21.5 Generator
Ken,
A seal kit worked in mine summer of 2017 and no leaks since. Guess I was lucky...
A seal kit worked in mine summer of 2017 and no leaks since. Guess I was lucky...
missnmountains
Active Member
They told me the tubes get scored. We ended up with new tubes and hoses.
Ken
Ken
Thanks for the tip. In our case, the carpet face isn't in good enough shape to bother with... I'm just waiting for my detailer crew to show up, before I trash the carpet altogether... so they can immediately do at least the initial clean up so we don't track that black stuff all over the place immediately afterwards.
On the previous boat, we had to use a combination of mopping, scrubbing with a rotary floor cleaner and then focused manual labor (me!) to get almost all of it up. What a pain!
-Chris
- Mar 25, 2008
- 5,522
- Boat Info
- 2006 Sea Ray 58 DB
- Engines
- MAN CRM V8-900s, Twin Disc Drives; Onan 21.5 Generator
Getting that black off of the non skid is a PITA.
Yeah, we escalated through a variety of various products last time... eventually arriving at a few individual black specks here and there that we had to pop off with a knife blade. PITA, for sure.
-Chris
-Chris
Ummm... @ttmott
I've only made a little progress, but now I at least know the model numbers and ratings for our Sub-Zero fridge and freezer. Can't say I know how to interpret the ratings, though.
The freezer is 4.0A and the fridge is 2.0A. So does that mean 4.0 or 2.0 amps when running? Without regard to actual run time? Then up to me to figure out how often they run, and for how long each time?
Or does it mean they would draw 4.0 or 2.0 amps per hour (or some other unit of time) if they were to run for that full unit of time?
Or...?
-Chris
Only when running. I assume they are both 120 volts AC. We will need the "duty cycle" which is the run time in hours over a 24 hour period. That is what sizes the battery bank. If, for example, they ran 10 minutes every hour that would be a 17 percent duty cycle. Then at 6 amps at 120 volts that is 720 Watts. 720 Watts at 12 volt DC is 60 Amps required to run the refer's. Now if the duty cycle is 17% that is 10.2 Amp hours per hour. Assuming you will be recharging every 24 hours then the demand would be 245 amp hours. Then there is the efficiency of the inverter and losses in wiring which let's say is 90% so the total demand would be 269 amp hours for 24 hours. Limiting the battery discharge to 50% that sizes your battery bank to 490 Amp Hours.
Got it, thanks very much. I understand that math. Is it equivalent to say 6A times 60 minutes equals 360A per hour? And the duty cycle of 17% of 360 equals 61.2A per hour? (Sort of bypassing the calculation of watts and then back to amps?)
Now I just need to work out the likely duty cycle for those two. Any likely guesses about "average" conditions? (Me realizing there's not a really an average, climate and door openings per day matter, etc.)
Duty cycle for additional prospective loads -- coffee maker once/morning, a couple minutes of microwave maybe in the late afternoon, maybe some TV/stereo -- all seem easier to suss out, given those are ON/OFF situations at our direction, not cyclic like the fridge/freezer.
Yes, all 120VAC. My target is charging 2x/day at anchor, coinciding with cooking times... and heating water, charging batteries etc. all at the same time.
I've been thinking of an LiFePO4 solution with inverter/charger, no alternator charging. A very quick glance at some Victron bits and pieces suggests that might be doable for somewhere between $3500-$4600, way more than I'd like to spend on batteries but maybe much easier to find a likely location with appropriate ventilation, deal with trim, etc. Not gonna happen soon, in any case; more like a next-year-sometime project.
-Chris
Now I just need to work out the likely duty cycle for those two. Any likely guesses about "average" conditions? (Me realizing there's not a really an average, climate and door openings per day matter, etc.)
Duty cycle for additional prospective loads -- coffee maker once/morning, a couple minutes of microwave maybe in the late afternoon, maybe some TV/stereo -- all seem easier to suss out, given those are ON/OFF situations at our direction, not cyclic like the fridge/freezer.
Yes, all 120VAC. My target is charging 2x/day at anchor, coinciding with cooking times... and heating water, charging batteries etc. all at the same time.
I've been thinking of an LiFePO4 solution with inverter/charger, no alternator charging. A very quick glance at some Victron bits and pieces suggests that might be doable for somewhere between $3500-$4600, way more than I'd like to spend on batteries but maybe much easier to find a likely location with appropriate ventilation, deal with trim, etc. Not gonna happen soon, in any case; more like a next-year-sometime project.
-Chris
I missed two factors, they are incidental in the battery sizing, but play into the capability of an inverter and they are inrush current required for inductive loads (compressors for example) and the power factor.
Regarding batteries - The really big issue with lead acid is the time required to charge. You will be looking at over six hours to charge 245 amp hours due to the absorption phase required for Flooded and AGM batteries. The big benefit of the Lithium technology is you can hammer them with amps until they are recharged and not have to deal with the absorption phase. Generator run time is significantly reduced. Make sure you look carefully at the lithium battery specifications; many of the cheaper batteries have small BMS' and cannot deal with high charge and discharge currents.
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We did nicely before with a 2000W/70A inverter/charger and a 440Ah bank, but both fridges were already AC/DC so not serviced by the I/C. OTOH, one of the fridges was on the same battery bank... so 440Ah came close (sorta-kinda) to covering the same amount of stuff... with our charging regime of 2x/day and/or with at least some alternator charging when we were underway.
For this new-to-us boat, I'm thinking a completely separate bank (and no alternator charging) would be simplest/easiest... and using LiFePO4 would mitigate both size and weight issues.
Looks like a Victron Energy MultiPlus 3000W 12V PSW 120A charger prices at about $1300. (Looks like their 2000W/80A version is only ~$150 less, not worth bothering with.)
Victron Energy LiFePO4 12.8V/200Ah Superpack, approx. $2200 includes an integrated BMS, and weighs only 21 kg/~46 lbs. They describe their integrated BMS as sized correctly (of course), and Rod Collins (Marine How To) has been complimentary about Victron's stuff and their approach to LiFePO4. (They also offer solutions with their own separate BMS, approx the same price for the pieces.)
Anyway, these two components are what I've thrown a dart at, just for my own rumination purposes in the short term. That's the "fewest pieces" $3500 package... and then there's installation and so forth (including wiring, fusing, etc.).
I'm comparing that package to our previous system, a ProMariner 2000W/70A I/C that was about $900 or less (IIRC) and 4x Lifeline GC2-equivalent 220Ah AGMs that were just under $1600 total (and the batteries weighed about 280 lbs, I think). $2500-ish for the stuff. No BMS present, nor required. Ideally not to be discharged below 50%. Decent recharging times, but not near as fast as LiFePO4.
200Ah seems slightly too little, though, even considering the greater discharge depths that LiFePO4 allows.
Which leads back to my need to sort out our potential real consumption math.
-Chris
For this new-to-us boat, I'm thinking a completely separate bank (and no alternator charging) would be simplest/easiest... and using LiFePO4 would mitigate both size and weight issues.
Looks like a Victron Energy MultiPlus 3000W 12V PSW 120A charger prices at about $1300. (Looks like their 2000W/80A version is only ~$150 less, not worth bothering with.)
Victron Energy LiFePO4 12.8V/200Ah Superpack, approx. $2200 includes an integrated BMS, and weighs only 21 kg/~46 lbs. They describe their integrated BMS as sized correctly (of course), and Rod Collins (Marine How To) has been complimentary about Victron's stuff and their approach to LiFePO4. (They also offer solutions with their own separate BMS, approx the same price for the pieces.)
Anyway, these two components are what I've thrown a dart at, just for my own rumination purposes in the short term. That's the "fewest pieces" $3500 package... and then there's installation and so forth (including wiring, fusing, etc.).
I'm comparing that package to our previous system, a ProMariner 2000W/70A I/C that was about $900 or less (IIRC) and 4x Lifeline GC2-equivalent 220Ah AGMs that were just under $1600 total (and the batteries weighed about 280 lbs, I think). $2500-ish for the stuff. No BMS present, nor required. Ideally not to be discharged below 50%. Decent recharging times, but not near as fast as LiFePO4.
200Ah seems slightly too little, though, even considering the greater discharge depths that LiFePO4 allows.
Which leads back to my need to sort out our potential real consumption math.
-Chris
swaterhouse
Well-Known Member
I am sort of thinking along the same lines using lithium batteries. My plan is to put in a power meter on the fridge and freezer and anything else we plan to run off the inverter next year and see what the draw is. I am thinking of putting the inverter and batteries on the port side behind the sofa so they are clean, cool and dry. I have way too many other things to tackle this winter to even think any further than that though!
Chris
A couple of things regarding the batteries. But first, don't discount too fast utilizing the engine alternators to supplement charging the lithium batteries; there are some things that need to be changed on the alternators to keep them from over heating. Another two boat bucks will take care of that.
Regarding the battery bank. Get batteries with integrated BMS into each. I say that because a common BMS ends up being a single point failure and will take down all of the batteries should the BMS fail. I like Battleborn better than the Victron except Victron integrates with their GX control and monitor stuff so when the time comes and AYBC makes the rule changes for Lithium monitoring you will be compliant. Battleborn is working towards a BMS monitoring feature but they are not there yet. The good thing about Battleborn is their specifications are bar none the best plus they have a best in the industry customer service and they have a 15 year warrantee on their batteries. Take a look at the Battleborn GC3 battery....
And as an FYI - Battleborn is a Victron authorized dealer/service center; they will put together a complete package for you at good discount prices. Just some alternatives for you.
Ditto all that! Although I'll also continue to research other non-Lithium solutions. (And I have to check with our insurance, so see if Lithium is verboten or not.)
How will you put a meter on the fridge and freezer? I'm not familiar with how those work... install between the unit and it's AC outlet? Or...?
That's useful, thanks again. I saw where Victron's SuperPack batteries each include a BMS, whereas their Smart batteries need an external BMS (which they also offer). I hadn't looked at Battleborn, though, so 'll do that too...
-Chris
Scott, you have to pay particular attention on the batteries due to the cold climate you are in and yet, as you know, not put the batteries in the hot engine room. Lithium batteries cannot be charged when their temperature is less than 15 deg F.
I don't know if you and @ranger58sb have been following my lithium battery project; I actually had an engineering company help me through some of the design details as when I started I didn't know a whole lot about the batteries. This is the design rough sketch that I did; the engineering company is making some changes but you get the gist of it all. There is a lot here that can help you also -
You might want to consider the Victron Quatro rather than the Multiplus - The Quatro will automatically switch between shore power, generator, or batteries with priority to shore power then generator then batteries. It's a nice unit.
