Can we really not do better then made in China?

[Pseudomind]

Well I suppose there is some type of new math logic in this car manufacturing business, but every time I hear about foreign made cars in the USA, and the "Big Three" auto makers, I wonder why the cars made in Mexico and Canada for the "Big Three" are not labeled as foreign made. There sure be some head scratching logic at hand?

 

[Tritone]

Well I suppose there is some type of new math logic in this car manufacturing business, but every time I hear about foreign made cars in the USA, and the "Big Three" auto makers, I wonder why the cars made in Mexico and Canada for the "Big Three" are not labeled as foreign made. There sure be some head scratching logic at hand?

It has to do with the percentage of American-made parts in the vehicle. I am not sure what the percentage is, but it has to meet it. And the standard is higher for cars assembled in Mexico or Canada.

 

[skibum]

So Tritone, let me ask you this. 30 years ago, we had carpenters unions, plumbers unions, roofers unions, HVAC unions, bricklayers unions, etc.. In 2013, you can't FIND an American citizen working on the job site. Illegal aliens are doing ALL of those jobs. Right around the corner from where I work (Montgomery Co., MD - a right wing extremist bastion for sure), they are building an office / retail complex. I have been watching the workers come and go for months. Damn near every single one of them is an illegal. If you want to know who the American is on the job site, just look for the person wearing the tie or pant suit and hard hat.

If the unions are so worried about my friends and neighbors, why are they not raising hell with the politicians to get those jobs freed up for the trades people? The extremist in me says that the evidence is fairly clear that the unions lied to all of those people that they claimed to represent. If they failed their own members to such a staggering degree, they certainly must be doing something wrong and are not worthy of my support.

 

[CV-23]

I put stuff back on the shelf when I see Made in China. Ford has been good to me. The Excursion & Explorer just keep rolling. The V10 and OHC V6 have been great motors so far. We like our Pontiac Grand Prix but will be the last GM product we own. Constant electrical and leaking intake manifold seal issues on the motor. Ford or Toyota will be our next car. It's a shame neither make a good marine motor....Bowties rule, Mike.

 

[Pseudomind]

So higher percentage of parts made where? in Mexico and Canada? Should not have anything to do with it. I am not talking about parts made outside the USA and then the final product is assembled within the USA. I know for a fact the Toyota is made in the USA and also uses 80-85 percent of it's parts made in the USA, to include the steel used. So if the complete car is made in Mexico or Canada, How then can it be American made? I know that Toyota's which come from overseas all have somewhat different documentation, So a Hyundai, most Toyota's, Some BMW's and Mercedes are made here within the USA at plants just like GM has, but the general public for some reason still wants to call them foreign made. The only difference is union or non-union.

Don't get me wrong, I would prefer if all items made were within the USA. But there is too much back door businesses shenanigans going on within our worthless congress. Just wait this cheap labor is going to come around and bite us from the wants of all the liberal, overly-zealous EPA's hoodlums, and global climate change zombies. But hey I will be gone by then, and as it is I do my part now with letters to senators, governors, representatives and even some money to a few, as well as the NRA, Second Amendment, Gun Owners of America etc.

The actual ones the true American Patriot needs to watch for I feel will be the Chinese within the next 20-40 years. Hey we built them up as a major power with our own money. Let's see they are building a new canal, and drilling for oil in Central America, and they are building fleet of aircraft carriers, with the intent of positioning at least one in each major ocean or seas. Oh I did mention the EPA didn't I well lets see we will be found liability responsible by the World Court for the pollution for all of the countries where these cheap items were made.

 

[Tritone]

So higher percentage of parts made where? in Mexico and Canada? Should not have anything to do with it. I am not talking about parts made outside the USA and then the final product is assembled within the USA. I know for a fact the Toyota is made in the USA and also uses 80-85 percent of it's parts made in the USA, to include the steel used. So if the complete car is made in Mexico or Canada, How then can it be American made? I know that Toyota's which come from overseas all have somewhat different documentation, So a Hyundai, most Toyota's, Some BMW's and Mercedes are made here within the USA at plants just like GM has, but the general public for some reason still wants to call them foreign made. The only difference is union or non-union.

Don't get me wrong, I would prefer if all items made were within the USA. But there is too much back door businesses shenanigans going on within our worthless congress. Just wait this cheap labor is going to come around and bite us from the wants of all the liberal, overly-zealous EPA's hoodlums, and global climate change zombies. But hey I will be gone by then, and as it is I do my part now with letters to senators, governors, representatives and even some money to a few, as well as the NRA, Second Amendment, Gun Owners of America etc.

The actual ones the true American Patriot needs to watch for I feel will be the Chinese within the next 20-40 years. Hey we built them up as a major power with our own money. Let's see they are building a new canal, and drilling for oil in Central America, and they are building fleet of aircraft carriers, with the intent of positioning at least one in each major ocean or seas. Oh I did mention the EPA didn't I well lets see we will be found liability responsible by the World Court for the pollution for all of the countries where these cheap items were made.

Now you sound like a crazy paranoid conspiracy type. EPA hoodlums? Climate change zombies? The NRA is going to help you? How? Is that the only body you can think of?

Name calling and distracting from the conversation is not going work. What makes the EPA hoodlums? What are climate-change zombies?

 

[OldSkool]

What I thought was pretty clear was you managed to pack an impressive amount of extremism in a short posting. Anything less and you can easily be dismissed as just another Faux-News watching nitwit who can’t think for himself.
.

I really wanted to sit this one out but your statement is totally uncalled for. One thing you need to know about this site is that when you start mud slinging and name calling you lose all credibility.

As for the unions (disappointed X Teamster), they have out lived their usefulness and have become nothing more than a financial gate for special interests. Most are in bed with company management anyways. Kind a like when the Teamsters let a company I once worked for hold our dues back for three month. This allowed the company to build a war chest for a local Politian that they were "contributing" to. After the election somehow all those dues were paid in full.
A fully unionized painting contractor in Chicago used so many illegals that whole job sites would close down when INS agents showed up. Wisconsin’s communistic teachers union is so much a part of the political arena it aint funny.
So what’s better, confronting an outside invasion of poor quality or condoning the internal destruction of our way of life by blood sucking parasite disguised as representatives of the labor force.

 

[jason78]

Personally, I would like to hear some input from Four Suns on the topic.

 

[Tritone]

So Tritone, let me ask you this. 30 years ago, we had carpenters unions, plumbers unions, roofers unions, HVAC unions, bricklayers unions, etc.. In 2013, you can't FIND an American citizen working on the job site. Illegal aliens are doing ALL of those jobs. Right around the corner from where I work (Montgomery Co., MD - a right wing extremist bastion for sure), they are building an office / retail complex. I have been watching the workers come and go for months. Damn near every single one of them is an illegal. If you want to know who the American is on the job site, just look for the person wearing the tie or pant suit and hard hat.

If the unions are so worried about my friends and neighbors, why are they not raising hell with the politicians to get those jobs freed up for the trades people? The extremist in me says that the evidence is fairly clear that the unions lied to all of those people that they claimed to represent. If they failed their own members to such a staggering degree, they certainly must be doing something wrong and are not worthy of my support.

I'm trying to understand you, so let me see if I have this right. You've surveyed a job site and checked passports and birth certificates. All of them were illegal? I find it hard to believe you did that. I also suspect that in your mind, foreign born means illegal. So there's your assumption.

Now on to your question about labor. I don't doubt you that there are some illegal workers there, but that's just a part of it. What I don't understand is your connection to blaming unions for this. Cheaper labor is cheaper, not necessary better. For a bottom line, cheaper is easy to show on paper, so it often wins. That's no surprise whether the labor is union or not. The union doesn't claim to represent, they are paid to as the body of workers is their sole client. Those jobs are freed up for anyone, that's the capitalism part. It's also capitalism that many Americans won't work for slave wages. But, we are also free to prey upon those who will because they haven't a choice.

So what lies did the union put forth, and how in your mind did it lead to foreign workers putting up that building? Clear connections, please.

By the way, I think the unions are raising as much hell as they can right now. There are so many headwinds with Republican politicians pushing through union-busting legislation in favor of corporations over the middle class these days, that they are weakened. Just what they wanted. Now, wages and talent goes down. What'll we have left in 20 years? Wall Mart jobs? That's what is worrisome. Ha, just wait till your fat old ass ends up in the hospital. Better hope it's a union one, instead of a low paid, bottom of the barrel Wall Mart hospital. Will your nurse be able to read? But you'll refuse to get health coverage, just out of pure defiance of Obamacare, even though it would have saved your life, forcing me to pay for your 30 pack year smoking habit along with your funeral, right?

 

[Tritone]

What makes the EPA hoodlums? Read this from a NON-PARTISAN source.

http://cei.org/sites/default/files/William%20Yeatman%20-%20The%20EPA%27s%20Assault%20on%20State%20Sovereignty.pdf

Personally I would classify the idiots that came up with carbon credits as climate-change zombies, but that's just me.

I guess you cannot read. It clearly states its political viewpoint on the second page.

 

[Tritone]

I really wanted to sit this one out but your statement is totally uncalled for. One thing you need to know about this site is that when you start mud slinging and name calling you lose all credibility.

As for the unions (disappointed X Teamster), they have out lived their usefulness and have become nothing more than a financial gate for special interests. Most are in bed with company management anyways. Kind a like when the Teamsters let a company I once worked for hold our dues back for three month. This allowed the company to build a war chest for a local Politian that they were "contributing" to. After the election somehow all those dues were paid in full.
A fully unionized painting contractor in Chicago used so many illegals that whole job sites would close down when INS agents showed up. Wisconsin’s communistic teachers union is so much a part of the political arena it aint funny.
So what’s better, confronting an outside invasion of poor quality or condoning the internal destruction of our way of life by blood sucking parasite disguised as representatives of the labor force.

Not so fast. I am not mudslinging, rather I demand clarification for extreme statements. There is too much name calling in this thread that goes unchecked. Statements must be backed up. Those that are not do not gain credibility. Your entire post is mudslinging. Sheesh.

 

[Tritone]

So far, the only one is this thread that has resorted to name calling of other forum members is you, Tritone, even if it is done passively.

If I did, please quote it.

 

[mistercomputerman]

Is his name ********?

wingle$$

 

[Tritone]

Typical.

About the American Legislative Exchange Council
The American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC) is the nation’s largest nonpartisan, individual membership organization of state legislators, with more than 2,000 members across the nation. ALEC is committed to advancing the Jeffersonian principles of free markets, limited government, federalism, and individual liberty. ALEC is classified by the Internal Revenue Service as a 501(c)(3) nonprofit, public policy, and educational organization. Individuals, philanthropic foundations, corporations, companies, or associations are eligible to support ALEC’s work through tax-deductible gifts.

I take it you are unable to comprehend. I guess the above must be too "Un-American"

It is incomprehensible that you cannot appraise the words you wrote. The statement is pure partisan politics. What part of "limited government" and "federalism" is politically neutral?

 

[Tritone]

I know your playbook: See if this sounds familiar

1. Admit nothing

2. Deny Everything

3. Make counter accusations

Let's look at the quotes.
1. Yes, not the best. I should have worded, "Your reaction sounds paranoid to me."
2. Not anything there. If "fat old ass" is what you object to, it obviously wasn't pointed at anyone because I haven't a clue what anyone looks like. It was meant generally, as we'll will all, if we're lucky, become fat old assess some day.
3. Not calling the reader a nitwit; meant to give respect to his intelligence by saying that would not be him, rather others. Perhaps not well conveyed.

 

[Tritone]

Alright...let's just try to keep it civil. Thanks.

Yes, let's. It's late and time for zzZZZzz. I look forward if this interesting discussion continues. I still don't feel my questions were answered directly without adding more accusations and topics to the mix. Oh well, perhaps it's better if those among us who are inclined to interject politics into simple discussions restrain themselves just a little. There is obviously a wide perspective and it's best not to stir the hornet's nest.

 

[islandhopper00]

Holy cow Tri, why exactly do you think anyone owes you an answer? Everyone is entitled to their opinion. No one owes you a job, and no one should demand a level of pay that doesn't support the economics of the company you work for. The key words being "you work for". Here in America, you can start your own company and make the rules as you see fit. Pay your workers what you think they deserve. Problem is, when you get on that side of the fence you will start thinking just like the business owners you despise.

I owned my own company, and paid a higher level of pay than the ones around me. I thought "employees" would recognize the respect....but no, all they did was get used to being overpaid and demand more! So, I fired them all and closed the doors. Take that example how you will.

America is in trouble, and it's no one's fault but our own.

 

[CV-23]

Holy cow Tri, why exactly do you think anyone owes you an answer? Everyone is entitled to their opinion. No one owes you a job, and no one should demand a level of pay that doesn't support the economics of the company you work for. The key words being "you work for". Here in America, you can start your own company and make the rules as you see fit. Pay your workers what you think they deserve. Problem is, when you get on that side of the fence you will start thinking just like the business owners you despise.

I owned my own company, and paid a higher level of pay than the ones around me. I thought "employees" would recognize the respect....but no, all they did was get used to being overpaid and demand more! So, I fired them all and closed the doors. Take that example how you will.

America is in trouble, and it's no one's fault but our own.

Yep.....I also pay better then I've been paid to work the same job and I'm a better cameraman than those I hire. They are fine but not better than me or have near the experience. People is the US are just not hungry anymore because the Fed feeds them for free. This house of cards will collapse...glad I'm debt free and prepared for the worst. Once you own your own company, you'll just get it, Mike.

 

[Lucky's]

Yep.....I also pay better then I've been paid to work the same job and I'm a better cameraman than those I hire. They are fine but not better than me or have near the experience. People is the US are just not hungry anymore because the Fed feeds them for free. This house of cards will collapse...glad I'm debt free and prepared for the worst. Once you own your own company, you'll just get it, Mike.

That one statement pretty much sums it up, Mike. Why would anyone have the hunger to work when the government gives them housing, food, cell phones, transportation, etc. We live in a society full of entitlement and laziness. Although I'm not the owner, I am a manager and have had to hire/fire a handful of people already since I've been down here. It is REALLY hard to find a GOOD employee because they all want $$$$$$, but don't want to do anything to earn it. Something has got to change.

 

[Tritone]

Holy cow Tri, why exactly do you think anyone owes you an answer? Everyone is entitled to their opinion. No one owes you a job, and no one should demand a level of pay that doesn't support the economics of the company you work for. The key words being "you work for". Here in America, you can start your own company and make the rules as you see fit. Pay your workers what you think they deserve. Problem is, when you get on that side of the fence you will start thinking just like the business owners you despise.

I owned my own company, and paid a higher level of pay than the ones around me. I thought "employees" would recognize the respect....but no, all they did was get used to being overpaid and demand more! So, I fired them all and closed the doors. Take that example how you will.

America is in trouble, and it's no one's fault but our own.

Please do not put words in my mouth. I never gave any opinion about employers or employees. In fact, many on here have expressed their despise for the worker. I have only asked for reasoning and rationale rather than rhetoric.

Regarding your first question, I am not owed an answer. The forum deserves substantiation when someone makes what looks, on the outset, to be an outrageous comment. If you have something inflammatory to say, go ahead, but it should be supported. Blanket statements do not help anyone.

I am sorry you had a bad experience with your business. I would be careful about generalizing it to the entire country, however.