Diesel hours-1250 too high????

J

jxm99

New Member
Jan 27, 2011
29
south florida
Boat Info
320 Sundancer 2005
Engines
twin 350 mag V drives
Found a solid looking 390 with diesels, well maintained upholstery as well as the engines. My question is 1250 hours on diesels for a 10 yr old boat. The broker tells me that's not high for diesels, if it was gas i'd be running for the hills. I've always been under the impression that once you turn a diesel on it will run forever as long as it has clean air and clean fuel. so are Cummins with 1250 high? low? middle of the pack ? at how many hrs does the typical rebuild occur. thanks in advance
 
I don't think 1250 is high for gas....definitely not for diesels. I assume you'll find that opinions vary on this. And like all things boats nothing really matters unless you have it properly checked/surveyed. Get a Cummins expert to tell you whether or not those motors are worthy.
 
I think that's great! Shows the boat has been used 125 hours a year and diesels run forever


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My gassers are pushing 1,400 hours. My neighbor's diesel is being rebuilt at 400. Now ask me what I think of hour meters as a measure of anything useful?!
 
RollerCoastr said:
My gassers are pushing 1,400 hours. My neighbor's diesel is being rebuilt at 400. Now ask me what I think of hour meters as a measure of anything useful?!
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touche my friend. That great for gassers. What's the problem with your buddy's? Poor maintenance? bad fuel?
 
He overheated, and continued to run her. 18 years old and 400 hours, it just compounds my frustration with hour meters.

I was born too early! Someday, there will be enough elec engines that we'll only refer to "total fuel burned", which is a much better measure. (at least IMO)
 
completely agree that hr meters are bs but at first glance they provide a lot of direction based info. I love low hr engines but i also dont want a 10 yr old boat with 187 hours. Gotta get those props turning or **** goes bad...fast
 
jxm99 said:
completely agree that hr meters are bs but at first glance they provide a lot of direction based info. I love low hr engines but i also dont want a 10 yr old boat with 187 hours. Gotta get those props turning or **** goes bad...fast
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But during that 10 years if the owner was meticulous with maintenance then the 187 hours is not a bad number. Again, it's all to do with how the engines are maintained, not hours on a meter or days on a calendar.
 
Yipee! Another hour question. I was there this is my first diesel engine year on the boat. Like they saying goes "Men and Ships rot in port" I don't think that is out of bounds for 10 years. I can only echo what others have said, mechanical survey will tell the story better then hours ever could...
 
Just the engine hours doesn't concern me, as long as the boat is priced below the average market. The average boat buyer will shy away from a recreational boat with more then 1000 hours on the engines, do demand for this boat will be low and it will sell at lower a lower price than a typical 75 hour/ year 390DA. What also may be a concern is, with 125 hours per year, does the seller have a service record showing annual oil and filter changes, annual measurement of SCA's in the coolant, bi-annual cleaning of aftercoolers and heat exchangers, valve adjustments according to Cummins recommended intervals, etc. Without the service record, you can only rely on the Cummins Tech who you get to do your engine survey to guess if the maintenance has been done and is current. The mechanical survey must include fluid analyses on lube oil and coolant.....oil analysis will show wear metals in the oil and will give you an indication of internal engine wear.

What may also be a concern is that in South Fla, this boat has been used about 2X that of the typical recreational boater. How much wear does the canvas, Isinglass, interior upholstery, carpeting and headliner show? And, how much sun damage and oxidation does the gelcoat show?

The good thing about a high time boat is that if you are an average recreational boater, the engines will be low time again in about 10 years.
 
Frank - what is interesting and what I'm finding out are good records for boats of this/our caliber are a rarity; particularly these of 10 plus years old. There seems to be in the 30 to 50 plus foot range a change in desire to both maintain the boat correctly and keep good records when that 10 or so year old mark comes. Possibly also there is a purchase price point and age or maybe it's as simple of the type of people that purchase these used boats then sell them where correct maintenance during their ownership is not a priority; who knows. I will say this, that the marina where I keep my boat, I can count on two hands (maybe one) the boats that I would classify as correctly maintained and documented; There has to be 300 boats in our marina.
I'm not saying this should hold up a good acquisition but it is a risk call and survey discussion.....
Also, for over a year I've been looking at 2005 to 2007 52 and 58 Sedan Bridges; I've looked at seven boats up and down the Fl coastline. So far there have been two boats that when I asked to have the maintenance records available if we should move to a commitment and survey that the broker/salesman didn't give me the deer in the headlights look and tried to fat-lip their way through the request.
Tom
 
Tom,

I agree with you. I guess I am in the minority.....I honestly care about my boat's maintenance. I don't trust anyone but me to keep up with what is needed and when. I honestly don't see how you can keep up with the maintenance on a beast with as many complex systems as a mid sized Sea Ray has on it unless you keep a detailed maintenance record.

My boat is kept at the local Sea Ray dealer's marina. We have about 100 boats, mostly Sea Ray's from 38 ft to 60 ft in the water and another 650 smaller boats in dry stack storage. The service department is excellent and conscientious. The mechanics really care but they take special of the boats whose owners are involved in their own maintenance and have service records. You might consider this point in your own search........most of the boat owners here are about the same "vintage" having bought into this lifestyle in the late 80's. Some are beginning to "age out" and aren't as involved in the management of their boats or their maintenance as they once were. The marina's service manager does a good job with these owners and they keep copies of all work orders. If a buyer asks a broker or the seller for his service records, the buyer may get your deer in the headlights gaze, but if you were to ask the service manaer of the marina, he will get you copies of the sellers work orders with one phone call to the seller for permission.

I realize that everyone isn't a gear head and the last thing some owners want is to get into the details of managing a boat to the extent that probably you and I do, but this won't keep me from asking for a service record. If I can't get the boat's service history produced, then I have to decide if I want to survey the boat or not and even more to the point: Am I willing to accept the mechanical risk of buying a boat where I cannot verify whether or not mandatory services have been completed.
 
Longevity can be based on obtaining correct WOT RPM under full load, engines operating at proper temp and also total amount of fuel used over lifetime of the engine. It's not quite that simple but those things are a good start.
 
Here's what an hour meter tells you. Nothing to do with engine health.
It tells you how much time has been spent using the boat. How many sun screened bodies have slimed their way across the seats. How many times the doors have been opened, the toilets used, etc. Components like steering can get sloppy.
I am not a fan of high hour boats just because a lower use creampuff can be found for similar money.
 
fwebster said:
Tom,

I agree with you. I guess I am in the minority.....I honestly care about my boat's maintenance. I don't trust anyone but me to keep up with what is needed and when. I honestly don't see how you can keep up with the maintenance on a beast with as many complex systems as a mid sized Sea Ray has on it unless you keep a detailed maintenance record.

My boat is kept at the local Sea Ray dealer's marina. We have about 100 boats, mostly Sea Ray's from 38 ft to 60 ft in the water and another 650 smaller boats in dry stack storage. The service department is excellent and conscientious. The mechanics really care but they take special of the boats whose owners are involved in their own maintenance and have service records. You might consider this point in your own search........most of the boat owners here are about the same "vintage" having bought into this lifestyle in the late 80's. Some are beginning to "age out" and aren't as involved in the management of their boats or their maintenance as they once were. The marina's service manager does a good job with these owners and they keep copies of all work orders. If a buyer asks a broker or the seller for his service records, the buyer may get your deer in the headlights gaze, but if you were to ask the service manaer of the marina, he will get you copies of the sellers work orders with one phone call to the seller for permission.

I realize that everyone isn't a gear head and the last thing some owners want is to get into the details of managing a boat to the extent that probably you and I do, but this won't keep me from asking for a service record. If I can't get the boat's service history produced, then I have to decide if I want to survey the boat or not and even more to the point: Am I willing to accept the mechanical risk of buying a boat where I cannot verify whether or not mandatory services have been completed.
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Thanks Frank; good information as usual. You are very fortunate to have such a high caliber marina and such good marina services. On this side of the state we would probably only see these customer savvy features in the Southern reaches.
 
Leardriver said:
Here's what an hour meter tells you. Nothing to do with engine health.
It tells you how much time has been spent using the boat. How many sun screened bodies have slimed their way across the seats. How many times the doors have been opened, the toilets used, etc. Components like steering can get sloppy.
I am not a fan of high hour boats just because a lower use creampuff can be found for similar money.
Click to expand...

On my pier alone, I can think of a dozen boats with fuel that could qualify for an AARP card. The engines are never run, but the boats are used every wkd., sometimes hosting parties, other times an entire family. I can't disagree more that the hour meters will tell you how much wear the boat itself has experienced. Hour meters tell how long the ignitions have been in the "on" position, and nothing more!

I know of a 300DA that will come on the market soon. It has the same fuel in the tanks that was in there when I met them in 2004. I'm not kidding. They've replaced both outdrives and an engine though, so there's that. If anyone refers to that boat as a creampuff, my conscience will not allow me to keep my mouth shut.
 
Of course there are exceptions. As a general rule, though, I find that boats with more hours have been used more. We don't have slips and live-aboards much in Colorado. Boats are trailered and used, then towed home.
 
My marina is at a place that's a destination for 10's of thousands of people everyday, so probably the worst-case for floating cottage syndrome. Even so, with all other things being equal, I'd rather have a boat that was used an average amount than one that was barely used.

Actually, marinas throughout the Great Lakes tend to host floating cottages. As expensive as boating can be, people who can afford a 30-year old 30 footer now have a "waterfront cottage" that they could otherwise only dream of. They won't maintain it, but they can afford to keep it and sooner or later someone will come by and get all excited about the hours.

That means that in the Great Lakes, hour meters tell more lies than truth.
 
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