Diesel View / Vessel View Upgrade

Discussion in 'Electronics Q&A' started by rlynch03, Feb 6, 2020.

  1. Chief Ed

    Chief Ed Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    56
    Jul 19, 2020
    So Cal
    2006 44 Sundancer
    Cummins QSC500
    Thanks for that, ttmott. Very helpful! Do you if the same mods are required for the older vessel view 5 (pictured in the first post above)? Or does that one still have support for CAN-V?
     
  2. ttmott

    ttmott PhD in OCD GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 3, 2012
    Space Coast Florida
    2006 52 Sedan Bridge
    Cummins QSM11
    I think VV5 is the bastard child as it does not have NMEA 2000 interface. You would have to display the generator data on another MFD with NMEA 2000.
     
  3. alnav

    alnav Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Sep 16, 2009
    West River, MD
    40 MY
    QSB 425
    I don't see a picture. Is this the VesselView 502? If so, it's part of a recent trend on the part of Mercury to source its displays (502, 702 and up) from Simrad/Lowrance. So, you may be actually getting a Simrad Evo unit, for example. The way I understand it, there is a Smartcraft side and a Chartplotter side; the user toggles between the two. So, if this is what you're getting, it might be possible to see the generator data on the Chartplotter side. Otherwise, as Ttmott said, any modern NMEA 2000 chartplotter or dedicated display such as Maretron, should be able to show the info once it's on NMEA 2000.

    The other recent difference is that the VesselView units use an external Smartcraft-to-NMEA 2000 converter (VesselView Link) instead of having the converter imbedded in the unit. So, you probably need to make sure you are getting one of those to ensure you get the engine data. I have also seen conflicting reports as to whether these units support the EasyLink gauges so some diligence is warranted there as well. The Yacht Devices engine gateway I mentioned earlier can also do the Smartcraft-NMEA conversion and will support the gauges.

    The steps for getting the generator data on NMEA 2000 are the same.

    BTW, documentation of these capabilities and how to use them is very spotty. Mercury, IMO, is among the worst in this area and has been for almost the entire life of Smartcraft (first gen documentation was quite good). You would think dealers could help but I have not found that to be so. If you love a mystery, chasing this down may make you happy. Ttmott has created the best documentation I know of.
     
    villain style likes this.
  4. Carpediem44DB

    Carpediem44DB Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Aug 18, 2015
    Sanfransico Bay area
    2006 44 DB Sedan Bridge Raymarine gs165 w Quantum HD Radar
    Achilles 350 Dink
    Nick Jackson Davit
    Cummins QSC 8.3 500 HD
    Tom, your grasp of this system and your selfless willingness to disseminate it so clearly and completely never ceases to amaze me. Thanks for taking the time and for being so willing to share your knowledge. It would be so easy for you to just think " I just explained that last month for the umteenth time, use the search feature" but instead you write out a complete explanation of the concept and specifics. I think each time you do, you do so in a way that is easier to understand. Just wanted you to know how much you are appreciated.
    Rusty
    Carpe Diem
     
    villain style, Shaps and ttmott like this.
  5. Shaps

    Shaps Active Member GOLD Sponsor

    373
    Nov 4, 2019
    Long Island,NY
    2010 Sundancer 500
    Twin Cummins QSC550 DTS w Zeus
    Tom,
    I cannot thank you enough.
    I should be on the boat Tues (if not, this weekend) and take inventory of how my system is configured. I will likelyhave some additional questions and truly appreciate your patience and wisdom on this.
    Thanks again!

    Shaps
     
  6. mschiek01

    mschiek01 New Member

    16
    Sep 15, 2020
    410DA
    Cummins

    Hello, I know this is an old thread however I am having some issues. My conversion is a vv1.5 to vv703. I am using cables 8M0075065 & 8M0075067. For some reason I am getting power to the vv703 however the vessel view link is not receiving power. I can plug it in with the kit cable and get power but the required 8M0075065 & 8M0075067 are not passing power to the unit. Am I missing something like a jumper?

    Any help would be appreciated I have quite a few days into troubleshooting with no luck
     
  7. alnav

    alnav Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Sep 16, 2009
    West River, MD
    40 MY
    QSB 425
    I considered installing a VV Link at one point and did a little research but never pulled the trigger so don't know too much about your setup. But, I reviewed my file and found reference to a cable you don't mention, 84-8M0111670 described as a VesselView Link Power Harness. I found it online:
    Mercury-Mercruiser 84-8M0111670 VesselView Link Power Harness
    [​IMG]

    https://www.mercruiserparts.com/8m0111670-harness
     
  8. ttmott

    ttmott PhD in OCD GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 3, 2012
    Space Coast Florida
    2006 52 Sedan Bridge
    Cummins QSM11
    Doesn't the Link get it's power from the NMEA 2000 network?
     
  9. alnav

    alnav Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Sep 16, 2009
    West River, MD
    40 MY
    QSB 425
    That was my initial thought but I found this in a VV manual:
    upload_2020-9-15_21-8-31.png
     
  10. mschiek01

    mschiek01 New Member

    16
    Sep 15, 2020
    410DA
    Cummins
    I am not sure the link documentation doesn't say. I had thought it was getting its power from the vv connector. I know the nema network is good as I see all the devices on it. However the link device will not show up unless I use the connector that came with the kit not the 8M0075065 & 8M0075067.
     
  11. alnav

    alnav Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Sep 16, 2009
    West River, MD
    40 MY
    QSB 425
    You might want to call the Mercury Consumer Support Team at 920-929-5040. I have heard they are very helpful these days, they used to have a bad rep.
     
  12. ttmott

    ttmott PhD in OCD GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 3, 2012
    Space Coast Florida
    2006 52 Sedan Bridge
    Cummins QSM11
    Now that's interesting.
    So harness 84-8M0075065 plugs into the Starboard Smartcraft J-Box then that connects to harness 84-M0075067 then that '67 harness interfaces with both the Link and VV703. Do you still have the CAN P crossover cable connected between the port and starboard J-boxes? It is that crossover that provides power when one or the other or both ignition switches are turned on.
    Does either get power?
    FYI Pin A in the Smartcraft connector/J-box is 12VDC Positive. Pin B in the Smartcraft connector / J-box is 12VDC Negative. You can trace these to see if the pinout is getting power with any of the ignition switches on.
     
  13. mschiek01

    mschiek01 New Member

    16
    Sep 15, 2020
    410DA
    Cummins

    I will try to trace the wires in the loom.

    This is the smartcraft connector I have. Not sure where the CAN P crossover cable would be.

    It looks like in the wire harness that as you said "A" is Battery positive "B" negative and "F" is switched key Positive
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Sep 15, 2020
  14. rlynch03

    rlynch03 Active Member GOLD Sponsor

    367
    May 16, 2019
    Annapolis, MD
    07 52 Sedan Bridge, 2019 Brig Falcon 360HT-30HP Honda, 2003 16' Dauntless
    Cummins QSM 11 660 HP w/ ZF 325-1A
    The cables (8M0075065 and 8M0075066) worked as Mercury said however I still had to patch in the power cable for the 703. It was easy to follow the OE cable (as a guide) and patch it into the 8M0075065 the same way Mercury did.

    By adding this Medusa style cable it provides the needed data for the Smartcraft 5" Tach and 4/1 Gauges to work. The Temperature also is now displayed from the Ambient Air Temperature Sensor.
     
  15. mschiek01

    mschiek01 New Member

    16
    Sep 15, 2020
    410DA
    Cummins
    The 84M0076067 cable comes with both connectors. One for the vv7 and one for the vv link.
    [​IMG]

    However ttmott got me thinking that the problem may be in the way the cable is getting power. In looking at it the vv7 and the vv link they are not getting power from the same pins on the plug.

    The original vv1.5 had a plug that came off the harness at the end with 3 wires that plugged into the port below "Vessel View Multi Ignition" The new 84-8M0075065 does not have this plug.

    I am thinking that with my setup this plug was providing both the battery + and the ignition +
    to the original vessel view. Of course I could be wrong but I am going to check it out later.

    If someone has a better idea please let me know.
    upload_2020-9-16_7-8-28.png
     
  16. mschiek01

    mschiek01 New Member

    16
    Sep 15, 2020
    410DA
    Cummins
    I have figured out the issue after I cut apart the 84M0076067. The cable is not compatible with VV702 or VV703. These cables came direct from https://sbmar.com they are supposedly experts and you would think they would know better but obviously they don't as I called called them and they told me these were the cables that were needed.

    You can use one of these cables as I ended up doing but you will need to cut it open and fix the wiring. It would be far easier to use the 84M007606 and just patch in the power cable for the VV702 or VV703

    In case anyone is interested here is the VV7 connector power + needs to be supplied on both the Yellow switch and Red battery. Black is power -

    VV7 Connector.jpg

    The 84M0076067 does not supply power on any of this pins. It was made for the original VV7 not the VV702 or VV 703.

    The original VV7 had a power port and a smartcraft port that is what the harness is for.

    upload_2020-9-16_21-26-34.png

    The 702 & 703 do not have a smartcraft port anymore all the data comes from the nmea2000 port via the VV link.

    upload_2020-9-16_21-29-12.png

    Thanks to ttmot & rlyncho3 for their help.

    Now I am on to getting the gen data on the VV703.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Sep 16, 2020
  17. ttmott

    ttmott PhD in OCD GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 3, 2012
    Space Coast Florida
    2006 52 Sedan Bridge
    Cummins QSM11
    Weren't you getting power to the VV but not the Link?
     
  18. mschiek01

    mschiek01 New Member

    16
    Sep 15, 2020
    410DA
    Cummins
    Yes the VV was powering up and was on the nmea network. The 84M0076067 will supply the power through the power plug. The VV link was not powering up. The smartcraft end of the 84M0076067 cable should have power however it did not. It is made for the VV7 which has the VVL integrated inside it. The VVL inside the VV7 received its power from the VV7 so the plug on that connector has no power.
     
  19. mschiek01

    mschiek01 New Member

    16
    Sep 15, 2020
    410DA
    Cummins
    Did you use a custom config on the Yacht Devices (YD) YDEG-04 or just the default one?
     
  20. alnav

    alnav Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Sep 16, 2009
    West River, MD
    40 MY
    QSB 425
    I was actually the first customer to use the YDEG-04 for this application. I worked with the programmers (who I think are in one of the Baltic republics) back and forth to get the settings right. So, we manipulated a number of parameters manually. I see they have incorporated all that into one of the standard configurations via a firmware update. The documentation for this update doesn't look like it's in the manual as yet but I found it in an update announcement:

    "Firmware 1.32 for the Engine Gateway was released in July, but it has new features, which had not yet been announced and were not described in the documentation.

    We added support of gensets (it can be turned on with GENSET=ON). This turns on processing of J1939 PGN 65030 (Generator Average Basic AC Quantities; SPN 2444, 2436, 2448), PGN 65029 (Generator Total AC Power; SPN 2452), PGN 65028 (Generator Total AC Reactive Power; SPN 2464, 2456) and output of NMEA 2000 PGN 127504 (AC Output Status).

    We also added a setting to request specified PGNs every second from all engines with addressed requests:

    ISO_REQUEST=65242,65253,65260


    This can be used with engines and gensets which report engine hours (PGN 65253), software version (PGN 65242) or serial numbers (PGN 65260) by request only."
    https://www.yachtd.com/news/august_updates.html

    If you go this route you will likely have to build up a connector (same is true with the Maretron equivalent) but it looks like you're certainly capable. Both ttmott and I have done this and can probably help. I was able to do the tap right at the J-box which is where my NMEA 2000 network lives. I think Tom's is close to the generator but he already had NMEA 2000 down there.

    I'm glad you asked as it looks like Yacht Devices may have solved the one problem both ttmott and I had which was getting engine hours out of the generator. All the other data is "pushed" over J1939 but hours has to be requested. this was the issue I spent the most time with the programmers over but neither of us was able to get that to work.
     

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