Harsh environment crimp connectors

Discussion in 'Electrical Stuff' started by Four Suns, Dec 7, 2008.

  1. JimG

    JimG Well-Known Member SILVER Sponsor

    Nov 4, 2008
    Southern WV
    2007 310 DA
    Kohler 5ECD
    Twin 350 Mags
    Raw Water Cooled
    V-Drives
    IMO, the only thing the shrink tubbing buys you is strain relief (which is good in some cases!). The ring end is still exposed and the more likely connection failure is the loose screw (assuming a good crimp). :smt001
     
  2. Four Suns

    Four Suns Not a pot stirrer TECHNICAL Contributor PLATINUM Sponsor

    Oct 4, 2006
    Williamsburg, VA
    2003 480 DB
    QSM-11 Diesels
    That's not really the way I looked at it. Stranded wire has lots of surface area to corrode and where the wire meets the crimp can corrode and break off. I've had bonding wires do that which were connected to the brass strainers/thru hulls. Sea Ray crimped on the connectors, sprayed them with a protectant, and then the small wires corroded and broke.... The other thing is if the wire area starts to corrode and the resistance goes up (like on a circuit drawing some big Amps), that could be really bad news...
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2008
  3. JimG

    JimG Well-Known Member SILVER Sponsor

    Nov 4, 2008
    Southern WV
    2007 310 DA
    Kohler 5ECD
    Twin 350 Mags
    Raw Water Cooled
    V-Drives
    Something else to note... the longer neck in your original terminal you speak of is actually intended to crimp the insulation for strain relief... not for more wire contact.
     
  4. Four Suns

    Four Suns Not a pot stirrer TECHNICAL Contributor PLATINUM Sponsor

    Oct 4, 2006
    Williamsburg, VA
    2003 480 DB
    QSM-11 Diesels
    Yeah.. I mentioned that... YOU NOT READING THE WHOLE THREAD?!
     
  5. JimG

    JimG Well-Known Member SILVER Sponsor

    Nov 4, 2008
    Southern WV
    2007 310 DA
    Kohler 5ECD
    Twin 350 Mags
    Raw Water Cooled
    V-Drives
    Yeah... I guess you did. I was bored, but not bored enough to read every word.
     
  6. Westie

    Westie Active Member

    Oct 16, 2008
    Calgary
    2001 260 Sundancer towed with the power of an IFORCE V8
    7.4 L Bravo III
    So what do you guys recommend for battery cable crimpers? Most crimpers I've seen are over $200 bucks.
    Are the hammer types like the one in the link below any good?
    http://www.nanaimomarinecentre.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=6_59&products_id=93&osCsid=ee653d4e13fb4e799f

    I have to rewire the batteries in my boat next spring as the previous owner has three batteries in it, all wired in parallel. There are anywhere from two to 4 connections per terminal on the batteries, plus one of the lugs fell off when I removed the batteries in the fall.
     
  7. douglee25

    douglee25 Well-Known Member

    Jan 13, 2008
    Dallas, TX
    Cruisers 3575
    Twin 7.4l
    Gary, do you ever strip say 1" of insulation off the wire, fold the wire in half to effectively double the wires thickness before inserting into the terminal? I've found this lessens the chance that they pull out.

    I've searched to see if this is an acceptable way and I've seen it mentioned both with and without folding the wire over.

    Doug
     
  8. Presentation

    Presentation Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor

    Oct 3, 2006
    Wisconsin - Winnebago Pool chain of lakes
    280 Sundancer, Westerbeke MPV generator
    twin 5.0's w/BIII drives
    Doug, please do not use my terminals.
     
  9. douglee25

    douglee25 Well-Known Member

    Jan 13, 2008
    Dallas, TX
    Cruisers 3575
    Twin 7.4l
    Are they 24 karat gold or something? :huh:

    It was a question as I've come across a couple different ways to crimp on a ring terminal. I did not preach it as gospel.

    Doug
     
  10. Nehalennia

    Nehalennia Well-Known Member

    Aug 22, 2007
    Marysville, WA
    2001 310DA twin 350 MAGs, Westerbeke 4.5KW
    Twin 350 MAG V-drives
    No I think what he's eluding to is that if you have enough room to fold over the wire and stuff it into a connector or terminal, you're using the wrong guage, and depending on the application can screw up the lighter duty control board type screw compression terminal strips.
     
  11. Presentation

    Presentation Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor

    Oct 3, 2006
    Wisconsin - Winnebago Pool chain of lakes
    280 Sundancer, Westerbeke MPV generator
    twin 5.0's w/BIII drives
    Todd, Thank you for trying to help.
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2008
  12. fc3

    fc3 Just another eclectic geek TECHNICAL Contributor

    Nov 12, 2006
    Northern NJ
    1999 Sea Ray 330DA
    Twin 7.4 MPI (310 propshaft HP) V-drives
    Twin Mercury Marine marinized 7.4L L-29 V8s
    Cast iron block w 4-bolt mains
    Isn't that like GM saying, "If you're going to let a slut like that ride in one of our cars, we would rather that you buy a Ford."
     
  13. Presentation

    Presentation Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor

    Oct 3, 2006
    Wisconsin - Winnebago Pool chain of lakes
    280 Sundancer, Westerbeke MPV generator
    twin 5.0's w/BIII drives
    I have never heard GM say that. I even Goggled it.
     
  14. fc3

    fc3 Just another eclectic geek TECHNICAL Contributor

    Nov 12, 2006
    Northern NJ
    1999 Sea Ray 330DA
    Twin 7.4 MPI (310 propshaft HP) V-drives
    Twin Mercury Marine marinized 7.4L L-29 V8s
    Cast iron block w 4-bolt mains
    They are not going to put it in writing!
     
  15. douglee25

    douglee25 Well-Known Member

    Jan 13, 2008
    Dallas, TX
    Cruisers 3575
    Twin 7.4l
    [​IMG]
     
  16. JimG

    JimG Well-Known Member SILVER Sponsor

    Nov 4, 2008
    Southern WV
    2007 310 DA
    Kohler 5ECD
    Twin 350 Mags
    Raw Water Cooled
    V-Drives
    This technique is only used when you don't have the correct lug for the size wire you are working with.
     
  17. wingless

    wingless Banned

    649
    Sep 2, 2008
    There are lots of ways to terminate wiring properly and many more ways to do it wrong.

    The crimp-on terminals required for the marine environment permits limited post-crimp visual inspection. My preference is loose terminals that are inserted into a housing after the crimp because the conductor, the insulation, the conductor crimp and the insulation crimp may be fully inspected to ensure conformance to requirements.

    The insulated ring tongue terminals used in marine applications conceal the business-end of the conductor and insulation crimp from detailed visual inspection, but there aren’t any options permitted.

    All that being said the two crimps on a typical ring tongue terminal need to performed properly, using appropriate parts, tools and procedures, to attain an acceptable lifetime.

    My preference is to use name-brand parts, such as Ancor or Amp, instead of generic parts. The Ancor parts have decent corrosion resistance and construction. The automotive and generic parts end up in my trash can.

    The general-purpose clam-shell crimp tool doesn’t get an acceptable conductor crimp and I also prefer the Klein 1005 crimp / cut tool.

    The Ancor terminals w/ adhesive-lined shrink tubing are great, especially in a wet environment, such as a bilge.

    Another factor to consider is labeling. Prior to purchasing my Brady IDXPERT I would print label text using Excel, on plain white paper, back it w/ double sided tape, wrap it around the wire and laminate w/ clear shrink tubing. This was a decent low-cost solution. The label maker is WAY better. Both ends of every wire are labeled. This has proven very handy.


    The best way to route marine wiring is to include a drip loop, so if water starts traveling along the jacket exterior, then the loop causes it to fall prior to entering the connector.


    The Fastenal crimp connectors look like generic connectors.


    The Klein 1005 crimp / cut tool is rated for 10-22AWG wire and has jaws for insulated and for uninsulated terminals.
     
  18. Uplate

    Uplate New Member

    977
    Oct 13, 2008
    Nashville, TN. Percy Priest Lake
    1998 Sea Ray Sundancer 310
    Westebeke 4KW Generator
    Twin 5.7 Mercruiser Carbuerated.
    Alpha 1 Drives
    Just curious, and maybe it is a Marine thing, but why would anybody want to use a crimp connector when a solder connection would likely be far more secure and conductive? Welding parts together have always seemed better than "smashing" them together.

    In our electrical work, a solder connection is always preferred to a crimped one. Heatshirink is used for insulation only as ring connetors attach to buss bars.
     
  19. Pirate

    Pirate New Member

    796
    Jun 26, 2007
    Knoxville, TN
    Currently Boatless
    Boatless
    Solder does not tolerate vibration or corrosion at all.
     
  20. fc3

    fc3 Just another eclectic geek TECHNICAL Contributor

    Nov 12, 2006
    Northern NJ
    1999 Sea Ray 330DA
    Twin 7.4 MPI (310 propshaft HP) V-drives
    Twin Mercury Marine marinized 7.4L L-29 V8s
    Cast iron block w 4-bolt mains
    The specs show that label maker's printer is thermal transfer. I found that thermal prints don't last and turn dark pretty easily even when not exposed to heat, like in the engine room. I am not a fan of thermal transfer printing technology. Have you found that the text remains legible for years?

    Best regards,
    Frank
     

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