Rudder position indicator

[Arminius]

Has anyone put a dash rudder position indicator on a Mercruiser Alpha One, Gen 2 outdrive? This Davis doohickey on my helm is not reliable. The provocatively named Bang-good company sold me one for $40. Swede and a Boat uses a vertical sheet metal arm under a bolt dropped into a clevis pin hole but I have my doubts as to its hardening and precision. Someone must have solved this mechanical problem other than Mercruiser with their newer offerings. I'm thinking a horizontal mounting of the pot on a a thick sheet metal plate between the clevis pins with the actuator rod engaged by a fitting on the transom mounting bolts. A sliding fitting on the pot's shaft is already provided.

 

[Arminius]

The pins have about .050" vertical play under finger pressure but my proposed plate would need to be thick enough to thread and would need a dogleg bend by the right pin as there is a step. Longer pins should be available. Think I will layout the forging and start on drilling and tapping. Back to the plate idea if the material is too hard and/or I break a tap. Could be worse. The blind work on the pins is not appealing.

 

[Lazy Daze]

Rudder position indicators are used with boats that have, well... rudders!

Mercruiser doesn't use them with stern drives. Just like in a car, it's so easy tell where center is that it's a "problem" that doesn't actually exist. In other words, there is no problem. Just turn hard over one direction, then back about a 1-1/2 turns and you're centered. Besides, with the way that small boats, especially, get moved around from wind and current, you can't rely on having the stern drive "centered" to keep the boat going straight. In practical use, a rudder indicator on a stern drive is of no help. A trim gauge isn't far behind......

 

[Arminius]

I'm an outboard guy. When I get close to the dock I turn around and look which way the engine is pointing and pause while calculating whether it should be forward or reverse and which way the prop should face. With an I/O, I trust my intuition which is wrong more often than random probability would predict.
Then there is skiing where I yell "straighten out the boat" before "hit it." I'm in the water getting cold and Susan's quick temper is coming on-line. I eventually recall that the next step is to yell, "Look at the ****engine" But now there is no engine to look at!

Maybe I'll go with 1/32nd" sheet steel plate material and solder nuts on top.

 

[bobeast]

Rudder position indicators are used with boats that have, well... rudders!

Mercruiser doesn't use them with stern drives. Just like in a car, it's so easy tell where center is that it's a "problem" that doesn't actually exist. In other words, there is no problem. Just turn hard over one direction, then back about a 1-1/2 turns and you're centered. Besides, with the way that small boats, especially, get moved around from wind and current, you can't rely on having the stern drive "centered" to keep the boat going straight. In practical use, a rudder indicator on a stern drive is of no help. A trim gauge isn't far behind......

I find my rudder position sensor invaluable. When maneuvering in and around a tight marina, it's probably not the best time to determine your rudder position by brail. That said, mine is not an outboard or outdrive so its impossible to visually determine which way I'm about to point.

 

[Pirate Lady]

I find my rudder position sensor invaluable. When maneuvering in and around a tight marina, it's probably not the best time to determine your rudder position by brail. That said, mine is not an outboard or outdrive so its impossible to visually determine which way I'm about to point.

I can see that. With i/o even very slow the direction /angle will affect the boat direction immediately. With a rudder, at slow, maybe not so much.

 

[b_arrington]

Frankly I never felt like I needed a rudder indicator on my single B3 drive. It had a very tight lock-to-lock turn, so I didn't feel lost with it. Basically center the wheel and you're good, with center being easy to find. With the thrust being essentially vectored by the drive, any forward thrust will tell you immediately if you're straight or not.

Now with my current boat I have an inboard and a smallish rudder. It has a like a 20" or 22" wheel that runs 6 full turns lock to lock. The rudder position indicator is extremely helpful when backing and making tight turns in the mooring field. My practice is to pull down the fairway, swing right to line up the the slip, center the rudder, and back in. I'll use throttle blips to control speed, and side to side position is controlled with the bow and stern thrusters. My last boat had the same type of setup with no rudder indicator making backing into the slip more difficult.

 

[Lazy Daze]

I find my rudder position sensor invaluable. When maneuvering in and around a tight marina, it's probably not the best time to determine your rudder position by brail. That said, mine is not an outboard or outdrive so its impossible to visually determine which way I'm about to point.

Yup, absolutely. I was only responding/referring to a stern drive boat. I used the inboard/v-drive simply as a reference.

Arminius, my suggestion... get more time under your belt with the rig. Chances are VERY high that you will find it's absolutely not necessary and will have wasted time/money and only have ended up with a cute little gauge in your dash that just sits there starting at you... reminding you how useless it turned out to be

From my own experience... thinking about how I maneuver a boat... "thinking" of the position of the drive just comes naturally. There's really no "thinking" involved. I really think you'll be just fine with some more time/experience... which means... you simply have to go boating more often! Which certainly ain't a bad thing!

 

[GypsmJim]

Davis Instruments RPI. I put one on 30 years ago and wouldn't live without one if I still had a pesky I/O. It mounts on the steering wheel center cap with stickum tape and is a gravity-type system with no mechanical or electrical connection to the outdrive. It gives an instant visual to which way the OD is pointing.

90% of the time its not needed, but after maneuvering at an anchorage or dock when the OD is at a huge angle, it surely comes in handy when you're ready to leave.

 

[Fill Ess]

Great project, keep us posted! I for one would love having one for docking.

 

[Arminius]

Your ideas help. Lazy Daze mentioned location on dash of read-out. I think an auto style external instrument mount up by compass might be good in heat of docking. Putting the potentiometer on the moving cylinder rod requires reversal of coordination-which was possible after some experimenting. Biggest obstacle was removing the heavy engine cover and I better cover the transom lube procedures while I have it open. Wonder if there is still a zerk on steering cable as that is a high maintenance item on O/Bs at least.

 

[Lazy Daze]

There's a chance the instrument will interfere with the compass. Put all associated pieces of the instrument temporarily in place to check. With a piece of equipment that has a moving component, try to simulate that, as well.

 

[GypsmJim]

There's a chance the instrument will interfere with the compass. Put all associated pieces of the instrument temporarily in place to check. With a piece of equipment that has a moving component, try to simulate that, as well.

The Davis instrument I referenced is plastic. It can even be removed and reused on your next boat with no damage.

 

[Juliery]

I agree no need. Set the Sea Ray medallion for center helm. Before leaving the dock, center the wheel to start. It's often hard over when docking to pull the stern in.

 

[Arminius]

Maybe I'm just toying with the chattering class. Generally inept, they hypothesize the most grotesque excuses to perpetuate their lazy defense of the status quo they purchased into. Nah, that couldn't be it. My tap drill worked and bright aluminum cuttings emerged. Securing the pot will be easy. Trying to figure out an easy post to place between the bolt stumps coming out of the transom.

 

[Juliery]

Maybe I'm just toying with the chattering class. Generally inept, they hypothesize the most grotesque excuses to perpetuate their lazy defense of the status quo they purchased into. Nah, that couldn't be it. My tap drill worked and bright aluminum cuttings emerged. Securing the pot will be easy. Trying to figure out an easy post to place between the bolt stumps coming out of the transom.

What was that? Are you drunk?

 

[techmitch]

What was that? Are you drunk?

Nope he's just lost.

 

[Arminius]

Progress report: Scroll below the image. Your thoughts are invited. Gave up drinking 30 years ago but a shot of whiskey remains a treasured thought.

Hard starboard and the end of pot arm will be so located, swinging to left as boat is steered to port. Radius will diminish and arm must slide. The Swede's double roller setup at the end of the arm would produce less read-out lurch than my intended rig with an additional tapped spacer under the epoxy at the axis. I'm on top of the head of the clevis pin so I ground away 1/2 of Ace Hardware mock-up but I should find clearance even if I have to redrill. Bloody pulling out blind cotter pin. That is soft aluminum the pot is on top of so take your time with the tap, backing off repeatedly to break the cutting peel, and you will be OK. 6-32 was used but 8-32 would be better. Tape on top of Allen head screws temporarily held the Allen wrench. String is to retrieve pot from bilge. Maybe I will replace a boat instrument on panel with this mechanical read-out, moving the little used instrument down on the dash. LD is right that an electromagnetic field is a bad companion for compass. Gadget instructions say I can reprogram actual travel of arm. Might take a break on this project. Yea, I cut one of the tabs off pot but it is tight in there!

 

[Juliery]

Your work looks good - creative resolution to what some find a need for.

Still mystified by "Maybe I'm just toying with the chattering class. Generally inept, they hypothesize the most grotesque excuses to perpetuate their lazy defense of the status quo they purchased into." from a sober man, though. Regardless of your dismissive assessment, I still have no need of an indicator for my sterndrive position - just another solution looking for a problem.

 

[GypsmJim]

Hours and hours and dollars and dollars and fiddling and fiddling when the solution was at hand and could take about 3 minutes.

I guess if its reallllllyy complicated it must be better.