The Official 450 Express Bridge Owners Club

Yep, that's about how mine was. Good work, good fix. You'll sleep better at night knowing this is permanently fixed the correct way. Have you checked the oval port lights? They can have the same situation. Mine were not as bad. i did the same process as the ER vents. Nice job!

@LMBoat, thx, will definitely feel better as I had been procrastinating. It was obvious someone had re-caulked at some point, but never done the job correctly. I'll post the repaired pics before I replace the vents.

Previous owner said he had the port lights done, I am skeptical. I need to do an inspection as there is some light rust. Previous owner claimed his kids/guests would open the port holes and forget (plausible as I have this issue) and then it would rain and water would get in. The seals are all definitely new as they are very soft and still high enough that it is hard to get the latches to close. Not sure if he actually had them pulled and checked on the core situation.
 
I want to pass along a possible concern with our boats operating in rough seas. We took a long trip this weekend from our marina to San Diego and back, close to 200 miles. The trip down was no problem with a following sea of 2 to 3 feet. Returning home the forecast was 3 to 4 feet at 6 seconds with a headwind at 10-15 knots. I’d say the first half of the return wasn’t bad, we were traveling around 12 knots. Then the wind and the swell picked up. I was dealing with a 20 knot headwind and 5 to 6 footers for the remainder of the trip and had to slow down to 5 knots.
I was doing good timing the waves and regulating my throttle, but I did have 4 or 5 swells that breached the bow. Here is the concern. I leave my bow lines coiled near the forward cleats. When a wave comes over the foredeck and into bulwarks those bow lines follow the water. When we finally made it back to calm conditions inside the breakwater near our marina, I noticed one of the bow lines went down the aft starboard drain and I could not pull it out. When we finally made it back to the slip, I was able to see about 3 feet of the line had exited the drain at the waterline. I was only operating with 3 of the 4 bow drains with that line stuck in there. I ended up cutting the bow line and I was able to pull it out at the waterline.
For our future trips, I will be storing the bow lines, especially in the open ocean.
 
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I want to pass along a possible concern with our boats operating in rough seas. We took a long trip this weekend from our marina to San Diego and back, close to 200 miles. The trip down was no problem with a following sea of 2 to 3 feet. Returning home the forecast was 3 to 4 feet at 6 seconds with a headwind at 10-15 knots. I’d say the first half of the return wasn’t bad, we were traveling around 12 knots. Then the wind and the swell picked up. I was dealing with a 20 knot headwind and 5 to 6 footers for the remainder of the trip and had to slow down to 5 knots.
I was doing good timing the waves and regulating my throttle, but I did have 4 or 5 swells that breached the bow. Here is the concern. I leave my bow lines coiled near the forward cleats. When a wave comes over the foredeck and into bulwarks those bow lines follow the water. When we finally made it back to calm conditions inside the breakwater near our marina, I noticed one of the bow lines went down the aft starboard drain and I could not pull it out. When we finally made it back to the slip, I was able to see about 3 feet of the line had exited the drain at the waterline. I was only operating with 3 of the 4 bow drains with that line stuck in there. I ended up cutting the bow line and I was able to pull it out at the waterline.
For our future trips, I will be storing the bow lines, especially in the open ocean.

Wow, that does not sound like a fun trip home. Glad you all made it back safe. Amazing that line managed to get into that drain, but I guess the water would have been encouraging it in that direction with what I'm sure was a hefty flow rate after you took a wave over the bow.

We leave lines at our dock and have second set of lines for travel, but certainly a good thing to think about for anything on the bow that might plug the drains, especially the larger ones towards the aft.

Out of curiosity, were you quartering the swells or just taking them straight on? I had about 5 footers at the same interval when I went offshore to fish in July and while it was a bit more work on the wheel, I basically tacked to the fishing hole and it really eased off on the apparent sea state. Was making about 7 knots and it took 2 hours. Based on your story you had a 10 hour fight for that last 50 miles...yikes!
 
Hi All,

I am still struggling with rainwater intrusion into the port engine pan. I know I have stopped the shaft seal leak, and I also know that it is not freshwater from on-board, and not sewage. From what I can tell, somehow rainwater is getting into the area just in front of the port engine pan underneath the port waste tank. There is wooden divider that separates that area from the port engine pan that has a notch cut out in the middle about 6" wide. I have tried several times with my borescope to get a camera into the location, but I really can't get a good look. It seems like there is a limber hole leading to the forward bilge from that area, but I have stuck a long screwdriver through that hole (and cut my head several times) when I knew there was water in that location and it didn't seem obstructed. Does anyone have an idea of what it looks like underneath that port waste???

Blige Layout 1.png
 
Wow, that does not sound like a fun trip home. Glad you all made it back safe. Amazing that line managed to get into that drain, but I guess the water would have been encouraging it in that direction with what I'm sure was a hefty flow rate after you took a wave over the bow.

We leave lines at our dock and have second set of lines for travel, but certainly a good thing to think about for anything on the bow that might plug the drains, especially the larger ones towards the aft.

Out of curiosity, were you quartering the swells or just taking them straight on? I had about 5 footers at the same interval when I went offshore to fish in July and while it was a bit more work on the wheel, I basically tacked to the fishing hole and it really eased off on the apparent sea state. Was making about 7 knots and it took 2 hours. Based on your story you had a 10 hour fight for that last 50 miles...yikes!
For the most part I was quartering the swells, but on occasion I did hit them head on. I forgot that I had the Nebo app going on my phone. Here is a picture from Nebo of the 105NM voyage. According to the app, my average was 9.7 knots. I believe the yellow lines are 15 knots. Red is 10 to 14 range and green is below 10.
The Admiral starting getting worried around the midway point, so I changed course and headed toward Dana Point to get cell service and to see if the conditions were better near the coast. It wasn’t too bad so we headed up to Newport. The green slow section is between Newport and Alamitos Bay where I got my proverbial “ass handed to me.” I should have listened to the Admiral and ducked in at Newport, but I wanted to finish the trip. It definitely was an adventure.
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For the most part I was quartering the swells, but on occasion I did hit them head on. I forgot that I had the Nebo app going on my phone. Here is a picture from Nebo of the 105NM voyage. According to the app, my average was 9.7 knots. I believe the yellow lines are 15 knots. Red is 10 to 14 range and green is below 10.
The Admiral starting getting worried around the midway point, so I changed course and headed toward Dana Point to get cell service and to see if the conditions were better near the coast. It wasn’t too bad so we headed up to Newport. The green slow section is between Newport and Alamitos Bay where I got my proverbial “ass handed to me.” I should have listened to the Admiral and ducked in at Newport, but I wanted to finish the trip. It definitely was an adventure.
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Cool app...can certainly see the bid to the NE to get cell reception and then the grind. Hopefully your wife isn't averse to any more long trips! My biggest concern about heading to Tampa for a football/baseball game in the boat.

I have yet to need it on our short trips, but way out in the Gulf during our recovery the Bivy Stick can get weather updates to your phone, text, and has emergency function. Kept my wife sane and me a bit more comfortable in a new, used, boat. Happy with its performance during our long offshore trip. You can turn it on and off and there is no contract https://www.bivy.com/stick. Not quite as safe as an epirb, but if you have a good bail out plan it will get you rescued and keep you in touch with everyone. Much less expensive than epirb and more functional.
 
RE rainwater leak, have you checked the large deck seam in the cockpit? Especially under the stairs? If not caulked, do so, if caulked re-do. That helped mine. you could get a hose and "flood" the cockpit floor and look for leaks.
 
RE rainwater leak, have you checked the large deck seam in the cockpit? Especially under the stairs? If not caulked, do so, if caulked re-do. That helped mine. you could get a hose and "flood" the cockpit floor and look for leaks.

@LMBoat thx for this. I had been talked out of it by the fiberglass guy I had looking at the boat. He told me caulking or not, the big hatch was like the engine room hatch and would just drain so it couldn't be my problem. Mine has been recaulked since the starboard engine is new in 4/2020. It doesn't look like the best work.

Going to scrape it out and redo and see if I can knock out that issue.

On another note, while I was chasing leaks I saw water dripping right on the cable master electronic package that is hanging from the unit just above the tub. My only thoughts on this is that it is coming through the bottom of the transom locker. Has anyone had to re-caulk the transom locker, and if so how did you do it?

Right now we are catching rain bands from the recent hurricane. Have my ER vents covered up as I was trying to dry up just a little more (was using my yard blower to shoot air in between the gel on the hull).
 
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On my boat, there are no drains for the big ER hatch like the smaller one. If yours does, great.

I have not had water leaking from the cable master in the transom locker. My locker is mostly dry
 
On my boat, there are no drains for the big ER hatch like the smaller one. If yours does, great.

I have not had water leaking from the cable master in the transom locker. My locker is mostly dry

My transom locker seems dry, but that water is coming down through the cable master into the tub, and ultimately into the ER, must be coming in under the transom locker and then down...I know the transom locker isn't sealed well as I had a friend place the aft anchor in there a little aggressively and speared an oil bottle and the oil started leaking out onto the transom...ughh.

I have a floor drain that looks exactly like the small hatch drain aft and starboard of the starboard engine, I assume that was for the large ER hatch, may need to look at my manual again. You cannot see any entrance to that drain so assume it must be for the big hatch. Admittedly, it doesnt drain well due to hose routing, which I am about to redo.

20210916_195100.jpg
 
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My transom locker seems dry, but that water is coming down through the cable master into the tub, and ultimately into the ER, must be coming in under the transom locker and then down...I know the transom locker isn't sealed well as I had a friend place the aft anchor in there a little aggressively and speared an oil bottle and the oil started leaking out onto the transom...ughh.

I have a floor drain that looks exactly like the small hatch drain aft and starboard of the starboard engine, I assume that was for the large ER hatch, may need to look at my manual again. You cannot see any entrance to that drain so assume it must be for the big hatch. Admittedly, it doesnt drain well due to hose routing, which I am about to redo.
Kevin,
After the rock and roll trip ended coming back from San Diego, for the first time I had water in the bilge at the stern, so much so that the automatic pump came on as the boat came off plane and we entered our marina. I think the entry point was at the transom locker when we struggled with the big swells. I ended up grabbing my wet vac and got the water out quickly. I'm heading down to the boat tonight to look at it some more. Remember, it rarely ever rains in California, but I'll let you know if I am having the same issue.

It is also nice to see that we hit the 10,000 page view mark with the thread in 9 months. And just for fun, here are the calm waters of Shelter Island. :cool:
SD9-10-21c.jpg
 
Kevin,
After the rock and roll trip ended coming back from San Diego, for the first time I had water in the bilge at the stern, so much so that the automatic pump came on as the boat came off plane and we entered our marina. I think the entry point was at the transom locker when we struggled with the big swells. I ended up grabbing my wet vac and got the water out quickly. I'm heading down to the boat tonight to look at it some more. Remember, it rarely ever rains in California, but I'll let you know if I am having the same issue.

It is also nice to see that we hit the 10,000 page view mark with the thread in 9 months. And just for fun, here are the calm waters of Shelter Island. :cool:
View attachment 112312

Nice pic!

We have no shortage of rain, 5.5" this week!

On my recovery trip we were in pretty heavy seas for a long time and I had water hitting the ER vents and coming in. Water was building up outboard of where the rudders go through so I had to use a hand pump to move it over to the bilge.

Since I couldn't re-bed the ER vents due to the rain, I put four 20w LED flood lights in the ER in place of the OEM lights. What a difference, but now I see more things I want to fix...o_O! I should have done a before image.

20210916_191855.jpg
 
ENGINE ROOM ACCESS HATCH LATCH

Hi All,

So, I have discovered at least one self-inflicted rain water issue. When I got the boat I noticed the seal around the ER hatch wasn't contacting the inner ledge and it was allowing the hatch to rub on the gel coat. Easy fix, pulled up the seal (it tore in a few places) and I used blue tape to keep it in place on the ledge and then put glue on the seal and closed the hatch. Next, voila, seal placed witha few minor gaps. No big deal, right? Wrong.

After closing myself into the ER while it was raining , low and behold, I see rain water coming in where the seal had some very small gaps and dripping (a lot) on top of the port engine and then right into the port engine pan. Apparently, if it rains hard enough, which it does often here in the Great State of Florida, the ER hatch drain cannot drain the water fast enough. If your seal isn't near perfect and the hatch secured you get to manually bilge water from the engine pans (and deal with corrosion issues).

So, that leads to my question of tbe day. My ER hatch has never had a latch since purchase (have been relying Isaac Newton for hatch security). The handle is there, but the latch isn't. Can anyone grab a pic of their latch and/or confirm the eBay screenshot below my latch images is the correct item?

Latch top
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Latch bottom
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Possible latch
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Here's what mine looks like, but I don't think the latch locking will fix the leak. First off, have you checked the drain hose for clogs? Get a hose and shoot water down the hole. Have someone check outside while you do to check the flow out the main drain. It should handle water from a hose full pressure without backing up. I've never had this drain not be able to handle water flow from the cockpit floor, whether from rain or washing the boat. (mine is on the port aft corner of the hatch rim.)

Secondly, the latch itself will leak. I could not figure out how to keep it from leaking, so I rigged a "catch can/funnel" under it. I used a funnel placed underneath the latch when closed, (I think I used wire ties to hold it to the ladder supports, it's been a long time since I did this). Then connect some clear tubing to the funnel and ran it down to the bilge under the batts. No more leaks on the engine and down into the engine pans.
 

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I won't be at the boat for a few days, but I zoomed in on this picture that might help for now.
SeaRaylatch.jpg
 
Here's what mine looks like, but I don't think the latch locking will fix the leak. First off, have you checked the drain hose for clogs? Get a hose and shoot water down the hole. Have someone check outside while you do to check the flow out the main drain. It should handle water from a hose full pressure without backing up. I've never had this drain not be able to handle water flow from the cockpit floor, whether from rain or washing the boat. (mine is on the port aft corner of the hatch rim.)

Secondly, the latch itself will leak. I could not figure out how to keep it from leaking, so I rigged a "catch can/funnel" under it. I used a funnel placed underneath the latch when closed, (I think I used wire ties to hold it to the ladder supports, it's been a long time since I did this). Then connect some clear tubing to the funnel and ran it down to the bilge under the batts. No more leaks on the engine and down into the engine pans.

@LMBoat and @Shoyrtt

Thx for the info.

The hoses are clear (they are translucent so I can see inside of them). Going to redo my floor drains. Where they interface with the main drain, seems a bit high and forces the floor drain hoses to be all the way to the top of the compartment and they still don't fully drain, especially the cockpit floor drain.

Need to lower that input to the main drain so I can lower the other hoses enough to create a slope to the port side of the ER.

Also, when I took off the ER vents I found that the center rod holders have bottom caps and tubes, that dump into area behind the vents...SMH. Assume the original rod holder installer had them routed overboard out of the ER vents, but over time they must slipped back inside. My pool plugs are helping there, but not completely dry.
 
I was able to stop by the boat last night and I took a few more pictures of the latch.
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ER Vent rot repair and re-bedding

After a 3 day project turned into 12 days, we are back up.

For folks who go through the ER vent process I would budget $300ish and at least 16 hours of actual working time (could be easier if you are on the hard as I was working on a jet ski dock and our house is 1/4 mile from an active marina...waves, waves, and more waves).

Step 1: Remove vents by detaching bilge blower hoses at the blower, remove 6 phillips screws on ER vent and tilt bottom of vent outward to clear the bilge blower fitting, remove hose clamp from vent side of blower hose. Set vents aside and lay them flat on their fronts so they don't warp.

20210909_171545.jpg


Step 2: Scrape out rotted wood

Step 3: Let dry (I used a shop vac and yard blower). This is more difficult when a tropical system lays down heavy rain for 4 days.

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Step 4: Cut pieces of wood to fill gaps (I used overlapping tooth picks where the rot was less than 1/4").

20210922_201002.jpg


Step 5: Pour pentrating epoxy into the gaps until just below top of hull opening (you can feel where the hull is getting hot as the epoxy "kicks" and it will give you and idea of how far the rot goes). Let epoxy cure.

Step 6: Use a filler to bring any remainng gap up to level. Let dry and sand smooth. Trust me, you want to sand filler and not epoxy.

20210922_201214.jpg


Step 7: Clean hull and ER vents of old sealant and wipe sealing surfaces with acetone.

Step 8: Install vent in reverse order, but leave screws loose so there is a gap between the hull and the vent. Optional: Blue tape around vent using old sealant lines to keep excess sealant off the hull (optional, but worth the extra 20 mins)

Step 9: Place a bead of sealant between the ER vent and hull.

Step 10: Tighten ER vent screws.

Step 11: Use caulk tool to remove excess sealant and have a rag with acetone ready to wipe up any that gets where it is not supposed to be.

Step 12: Remove blue tape and allow sealant to dry (image is pink due to setting sun)

20210922_201227.jpg


Step 13: Re-attach interior bilge blower hoses

Step 13: Clean and wax surrounding hull and ER Vents as the acetone will have removed all of your UV protection.
 
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