Westerbeke BCGB Remote Connector

[John E3]

I picked up a 7.0 BCGB genset yesterday and need clarity on a very specific thing - Will this run correctly -without- the remote connector (and corresponding boat) connected to it?
I had it running under load, but only if I held the switch on the ON position. Temp sensors and oil pressure are good, so no issues there.
I'm replacing a blown BCTGC and the engine and wiring are nearly identical (except rpm of course) between the 2 models, but I see in the BCTGC manuals that there is a Jumper shown in the wiring diagram when there is no remote On/Off switch panel, but this is conspicuously missing in the BCGB manuals. It seems like a 'no brainer', but it will be quite some time before I will be running it again, and able to confirm if this fixes it, vs hours tracing wires, testing relays, etc. I would expect it to be between pins 2 & 5 (or 11 & 13 for second station) of the remote connector. The BCTGC is hard wired inside the panel, so there is no equivalent connector in my boat. This jumper connects the sensors to the ckt board, hence my no brainer assumption!
Ironically this is the same indication on my dead BCGTC, but in this case it's due to a missing connecting rod, and inability to build oil pressure. Apparently a previous owner blew it up, patched the hole and continued to run, or maybe didn't run it again. The guy I got it from said he used it a little, then then it died and was not able to figure it out. I spotted a patch under the starter and found the patched hole. Sounds normal as long as you hold the switch!
Thanks, John

 

[PlayDate]

John,

Welcome to CSR.

I have a 7.0 BCGD that came with a shorting plug to be used if you don't have a remote harness and switch available. The wiring diagram (drawing number 46876) shows that the shorting plug is used on all 7.0 BCGC and BCGD models. The shorting plug is a jumper between pins #2 and #5.

The original generator (Quicksilver 7.5) was hardwired to the interior panel and I ended up getting a new harness from Westerbeke that came with a connecting plug on it at the generator end. The interior panel end may require a different start/run switch depending on what is currently installed.

Post a picture of the broken generator when you get a chance. I have never seen one throw a rod.

 

[John E3]

Yeah, so as my luck would have it, I stumbled across that jumper plug after I posted.
That plug is $28, but if you want wires to go with it, it's $184. I will probably fit it with a terminal block, and tie in my existing wires to that. There is a Monplex Gen-Set 4 module that ties into the boat harness, and feeds the genset.
Here's the hole with the bare crank journal visible inside.

 

[ttmott]

Yeah, so as my luck would have it, I stumbled across that jumper plug after I posted.
That plug is $28, but if you want wires to go with it, it's $184. I will probably fit it with a terminal block, and tie in my existing wires to that. There is a Monplex Gen-Set 4 module that ties into the boat harness, and feeds the genset.
Here's the hole with the bare crank journal visible inside.

The Monoplex was used to execute the starting sequence and allowed Sea Ray to use a single switch to start and stop the genset. Typically the single switch first activated the relay in the boat's fire protection Fireboy module and that relay provided the loop power for the generator to run. The start switch, like a typical ignition switch first turned on the power then the momentary action activated the Monoplex sequence. Here is a schematic for my old boat's generator which was diesel but the control wiring would be very close to the same with the same colors.

 

[PlayDate]

Yeah, so as my luck would have it, I stumbled across that jumper plug after I posted.
That plug is $28, but if you want wires to go with it, it's $184. I will probably fit it with a terminal block, and tie in my existing wires to that. There is a Monplex Gen-Set 4 module that ties into the boat harness, and feeds the genset.
Here's the hole with the bare crank journal visible inside.

Yikes! Not sure how that happened since there is not connecting rod on that journal. Maybe hydrolock.....

Anyway ....I'm not a fan of Monoplex Gen Set module. Just another thing to go wrong. I would just buy a Westerbeke harness off ebay and wire it up.

 

[John E3]

TTmott, Thanks for the info. I am familiar with the Monoplex. The Supplemental manual for the 370AC has it shown, but the connections to the generator, TB1, TB2 & TB3, shown don't match the BCTGC single TB1. I somehow missed that page in the manual before, but as I disconnect the wires I can figure it out. Inside the BCTGC panel is a rats nest of wires, compared to the simplistic layout of the BCBG. All the same parts, radically different layout.
The remote connecter is a nice feature, but a cable at $184 plus shipping, ouch. A $28 jumper plug may be the answer. I should be able to identify the brand and buy some new terminals for it. With my luck I probably have one lost in boxes of old electrical/electronics in my workshop, but could take forever to look for it. I have a number of specialized crimping tools, and may get lucky on this one. Oh, wait, that's not my luck. It seems my plans evolve on a daily basis as I find bits and pieces of new info.
Just having a replacement gen-set is a huge relief. A new one is almost 4 times what I paid for this one, and 25% of what we paid for the entire boat.

 

[John E3]

Yikes! Not sure how that happened since there is not connecting rod on that journal. Maybe hydrolock.....

Anyway ....I'm not a fan of Monoplex Gen Set module. Just another thing to go wrong. I would just buy a Westerbeke harness off ebay and wire it up.

I plan to open it up after it's in my shop and see exactly what I find. I can see the skirt of the piston in there, but no sign of the rod coming off of it. Given that someone took the time to patch the hole, it's possible they got the rod remnants off the crank, but that leaves the open oil hole. I am starting to wonder if the crank end of the rod was still in place for some time, and broke off later as the last owner claimed he used it till it just stopped one day. He runs the marina yard where the boat is, so I'm fairly confident he didn't know. He only had it 1.5 seasons.
Since the engines on the 2 models are nearly identical I pondered switching the generator and governor from mine to this engine, as mine is a 9.6, but not sure it's worth the effort, plus the BCBG is much quieter (and longer life?) than the 3600rpm BCGTC. The 7.0kw output is within 2 amps of the 2 30a shore power connections, so minimal 'loss'. Startup currents on the AC units is the only concern.
As long as the Monoplex continues to work, I'm going to leave it alone. I've got too much to do otherwise!

 

[John E3]

On other interesting note, the original generator does not have the "optional for Sea Ray" second oil pressure switch, but the BCGB does have it. The boat wiring does show it going to the connector for the Systems Monitor. The BCBG came out of a Chris Craft.

 

[John E3]

John,

Welcome to CSR.

I have a 7.0 BCGD that came with a shorting plug to be used if you don't have a remote harness and switch available. The wiring diagram (drawing number 46876) shows that the shorting plug is used on all 7.0 BCGC and BCGD models. The shorting plug is a jumper between pins #2 and #5.

The original generator (Quicksilver 7.5) was hardwired to the interior panel and I ended up getting a new harness from Westerbeke that came with a connecting plug on it at the generator end. The interior panel end may require a different start/run switch depending on what is currently installed.

Post a picture of the broken generator when you get a chance. I have never seen one throw a rod.

So, it seems Westerbeke is trying to make my life difficult. I got the correct part number jumper block today, and the jumper is in the wrong pins. It is between 14 & 15, and 15 isn't even used. Thankfully it is a commonly used series of connector and I happen to have the removal tool, pins and crimper to put it onto my existing wiring. At least that went in my favor. Unfortunately the tools and pins are 100 miles away at our business in NJ.
That would have been super frustrating for anyone without the tool, plus the empty #15 terminal is barely visible in the panel to have even a clue why it didn't work.

 

[John E3]

On other interesting note, the original generator does not have the "optional for Sea Ray" second oil pressure switch, but the BCGB does have it. The boat wiring does show it going to the connector for the Systems Monitor. The BCBG came out of a Chris Craft.

Seems I was mistaken on this. The oil pressure switch is there, on a tee off the other one, and the wire was added to the outside of the harness back to the panel.

 

[dwna1a]

Where did you find the Westerbeke? I’m hunting a part for mine or a complete 2cly from anyone anywhere.

 

[John E3]

Where did you find the Westerbeke? I’m hunting a part for mine or a complete 2cly from anyone anywhere.

The replacement 7.0 BCGB? Craigslist over 100 miles away. Damn few out there in 7 or 9.6. Noone seems to take out good ones. This guy bought a boat with it already removed, then got a better boat and didn't want to have to reinstall it to for the sale.
I have a 9.6 with 2 good cylinders.....
I've not see any 2cyl models, but wasn't looking that small.

 

[dwna1a]

Mine came this way and I need a new exhaust manifold, mine is in borrowed time.

Thank you

 

[John E3]

The Monoplex was used to execute the starting sequence and allowed Sea Ray to use a single switch to start and stop the genset. Typically the single switch first activated the relay in the boat's fire protection Fireboy module and that relay provided the loop power for the generator to run. The start switch, like a typical ignition switch first turned on the power then the momentary action activated the Monoplex sequence. Here is a schematic for my old boat's generator which was diesel but the control wiring would be very close to the same with the same colors.

@ttmott Any chance you can provide a higher resolution version of your drawing? I can't quite make out the details.
I am really scratching my head on figuring out how to wire to the BCGB. I color traced the the 2 wiring diagrams and know which terminals correspond with each model, but there are more wires going into the BCGTC panel, that don't exist in the BCGB connector. 3 Red/Vio connected together to the 8a fuse, and a 2 (like a 'zip cord') red/vio and black going to the hour meter. A key difference between the models is that the battery charging circuit wire is internal to the BCGB, and external on the BCGTC, but that wire is obvious on both. There is also a minor difference with the choke solenoid as well. The BCGTC uses an oil temp switch to keep it engaged, and the BCGB uses the control board to energize it via the "ON" switch to hold it energized after it starts, as per the operation manual.
I have studied the "Section 12 Supplement" wiring diagrams for our model, 370AC, which has only added confusion. It shows 3 terminal boards in the generator, and the circuit numbers don't match the numbers on the wires in the boat. The diagrams reference things like "to 09-602" but nothing is labeled 09-602. I assume they are probably internal wiring diagram numbers. I tried correlating them to drawings by page, but there are more references than pages. The Halon system has 2 wires labeled to the generator, which also appear in the System Monitor drawing, same number, same color, but only the Aux Oil Pressure switch wire aligns with this. No clue where the other wire, violet "Gen On", goes. There is no violet wire at the Monplex or generator. However, it does appear at the "remote bypass" switch, "to be provided and installed by the plant" as per the drawing. I've seen references to this switch in other posts (like the one where an electrician charged $300 to toggle it), but if it's installed on our boat, I have not seen it. It's in the generator panel in that mentioned post. If its hidden somewhere (or hard wired??) on our model it could explain one of the extra R/V wires.
I found that the 380AC Supplement has significantly more detail than the 370AC manual, with only a few differences. However, it is equally confusing. It shows the 3pin Monoplex connector for the single switch design on 1 page, but there is no drawing of the Monplex (as the 370 manual has), and on the generator wiring page it shows the double switch arrangement going directly to the generator. If I had double switches this would answer ALL my questions, as it has both the 15pin connector connected to the single terminal board, like mine. The 380 manual does have the "09-60x" numbers on each wiring diagram, so hopefully that matches mine.
At this point I have to assume that Sea Ray made changes to the wiring over the course of years they made this model, and did not update the supplement.
The 370 does not have the Fireboy Halon module, but it does appear in the Diesel engine diagram of the 380 so it must be a newer feature. To my knowledge my Halon is just a NC switch that opens when triggered, and must be connected to the engines and generator somewhere, with that mystery violet wire.

 

[techmitch]

@ttmott Any chance you can provide a higher resolution version of your drawing? I can't quite make out the details.
I am really scratching my head on figuring out how to wire to the BCGB. I color traced the the 2 wiring diagrams and know which terminals correspond with each model, but there are more wires going into the BCGTC panel, that don't exist in the BCGB connector. 3 Red/Vio connected together to the 8a fuse, and a 2 (like a 'zip cord') red/vio and black going to the hour meter. A key difference between the models is that the battery charging circuit wire is internal to the BCGB, and external on the BCGTC, but that wire is obvious on both. There is also a minor difference with the choke solenoid as well. The BCGTC uses an oil temp switch to keep it engaged, and the BCGB uses the control board to energize it via the "ON" switch to hold it energized after it starts, as per the operation manual.
I have studied the "Section 12 Supplement" wiring diagrams for our model, 370AC, which has only added confusion. It shows 3 terminal boards in the generator, and the circuit numbers don't match the numbers on the wires in the boat. The diagrams reference things like "to 09-602" but nothing is labeled 09-602. I assume they are probably internal wiring diagram numbers. I tried correlating them to drawings by page, but there are more references than pages. The Halon system has 2 wires labeled to the generator, which also appear in the System Monitor drawing, same number, same color, but only the Aux Oil Pressure switch wire aligns with this. No clue where the other wire, violet "Gen On", goes. There is no violet wire at the Monplex or generator. However, it does appear at the "remote bypass" switch, "to be provided and installed by the plant" as per the drawing. I've seen references to this switch in other posts (like the one where an electrician charged $300 to toggle it), but if it's installed on our boat, I have not seen it. It's in the generator panel in that mentioned post. If its hidden somewhere (or hard wired??) on our model it could explain one of the extra R/V wires.
I found that the 380AC Supplement has significantly more detail than the 370AC manual, with only a few differences. However, it is equally confusing. It shows the 3pin Monoplex connector for the single switch design on 1 page, but there is no drawing of the Monplex (as the 370 manual has), and on the generator wiring page it shows the double switch arrangement going directly to the generator. If I had double switches this would answer ALL my questions, as it has both the 15pin connector connected to the single terminal board, like mine. The 380 manual does have the "09-60x" numbers on each wiring diagram, so hopefully that matches mine.
At this point I have to assume that Sea Ray made changes to the wiring over the course of years they made this model, and did not update the supplement.
The 370 does not have the Fireboy Halon module, but it does appear in the Diesel engine diagram of the 380 so it must be a newer feature. To my knowledge my Halon is just a NC switch that opens when triggered, and must be connected to the engines and generator somewhere, with that mystery violet wire.

https://www.adobe.com/creativecloud...765088!!!g!!!1413573331!55719868215&mv=search

 

[John E3]

https://www.adobe.com/creativecloud...765088!!!g!!!1413573331!55719868215&mv=search

Thanks, but that does not change the resolution of the image as posted here.

 

[ttmott]

@ttmott Any chance you can provide a higher resolution version of your drawing? I can't quite make out the details.
I am really scratching my head on figuring out how to wire to the BCGB. I color traced the the 2 wiring diagrams and know which terminals correspond with each model, but there are more wires going into the BCGTC panel, that don't exist in the BCGB connector. 3 Red/Vio connected together to the 8a fuse, and a 2 (like a 'zip cord') red/vio and black going to the hour meter. A key difference between the models is that the battery charging circuit wire is internal to the BCGB, and external on the BCGTC, but that wire is obvious on both. There is also a minor difference with the choke solenoid as well. The BCGTC uses an oil temp switch to keep it engaged, and the BCGB uses the control board to energize it via the "ON" switch to hold it energized after it starts, as per the operation manual.
I have studied the "Section 12 Supplement" wiring diagrams for our model, 370AC, which has only added confusion. It shows 3 terminal boards in the generator, and the circuit numbers don't match the numbers on the wires in the boat. The diagrams reference things like "to 09-602" but nothing is labeled 09-602. I assume they are probably internal wiring diagram numbers. I tried correlating them to drawings by page, but there are more references than pages. The Halon system has 2 wires labeled to the generator, which also appear in the System Monitor drawing, same number, same color, but only the Aux Oil Pressure switch wire aligns with this. No clue where the other wire, violet "Gen On", goes. There is no violet wire at the Monplex or generator. However, it does appear at the "remote bypass" switch, "to be provided and installed by the plant" as per the drawing. I've seen references to this switch in other posts (like the one where an electrician charged $300 to toggle it), but if it's installed on our boat, I have not seen it. It's in the generator panel in that mentioned post. If its hidden somewhere (or hard wired??) on our model it could explain one of the extra R/V wires.
I found that the 380AC Supplement has significantly more detail than the 370AC manual, with only a few differences. However, it is equally confusing. It shows the 3pin Monoplex connector for the single switch design on 1 page, but there is no drawing of the Monplex (as the 370 manual has), and on the generator wiring page it shows the double switch arrangement going directly to the generator. If I had double switches this would answer ALL my questions, as it has both the 15pin connector connected to the single terminal board, like mine. The 380 manual does have the "09-60x" numbers on each wiring diagram, so hopefully that matches mine.
At this point I have to assume that Sea Ray made changes to the wiring over the course of years they made this model, and did not update the supplement.
The 370 does not have the Fireboy Halon module, but it does appear in the Diesel engine diagram of the 380 so it must be a newer feature. To my knowledge my Halon is just a NC switch that opens when triggered, and must be connected to the engines and generator somewhere, with that mystery violet wire.

I made it larger; hopefully helps. If not I can email it to you.

 

[John E3]

I made it larger; hopefully helps. If not I can email it to you.

Yep, that works, thanks. At a glance it looks a lot like what is in my manual for the Gas model, but different screws on the terminal blocks in the genset.
The Halon system wiring is not helpful, unfortunately. As far as I know, mine is just a pressure switch, and no module. The wiring diagram shows 2 wires in parallel with the Systems Monitor, and "to generator". The Violet wire does not arrive at the generator, or the monoplex. The other is the genset aux oil pressure switch to alert at the System Monitor.
That pesky "generator remote bypass switch" could answer some questions, if I knew where it was, or if it even exists. That's where the voilet wire goes, according to the 'wrong' diagram in my book, and also ties into "E" on the Monoplex, and the other side of the switch goes to "C". My "E" has no connection, and "C" goes to a red/vio wire, which I suspect connects to the a fuse, along with 2 more red/vio. Then there is that 2 wire zip cord going to the hour meter.....
I was of the understanding that if the Halon triggered that would shutdown the engines and the genset. With the Halon Module it's clearly the case, but I can't see how that would work with just a switch, and the Violet wires not connected to anything that I can find on mine, nor any indication it goes to the engines. The violet color is used in the feed to the engine coils, but you can't count on the color. That wouldn't stop the fuel flow either.
I may have to unbundle the rats nest of cables next to the Monoplex and see what's hidden inside. The corrugated black plastic sheath is already disintegrating so it won't take much. They must have had a bad batch of this stuff, as there are other places on the boat with the same issue, but not most of it, thankfully. There's a pile of crumbs of it accumulating under the helm, too.

 

[ttmott]

Odd you can't find the relay module on the fire suppression system - not on gasoline powered boats??
On the single switch remote start with the Monoplex (at least for the BTD's) the first switch position on the remote switch from off provides B+ to the Sea-Fire relay module and closes the Generator relay in that module. The B- side of that relay goes through the pressure switch on the fire extinguisher bottle. So, when you actuate the remote switch it closes that relay and that relay completes the ignition circuit for the generator (the White/Red wires). The generator will not start nor run unless that remote switch is turned on - not even from the generator installed start switch. So, operating from the remote switch - press to center position then it should be momentary to the start position - hold in that position until the Monoplex completes it's sequence and cranks and starts the generator. To start from the generator mounted switch, position the remote switch to the mid (ignition) position then on the generator press the switch and hold until the Monoplex completes it's sequence and starts the generator then release that switch. To shut down position the remote switch to OFF. It your generator has an emergency stop switch mounted on the unit - it should always be in the closed (on) position.
Look closely at Plug/Cap Gen 1 (shown in my drawing) as it is not designed to carry very high current. I found the White/Red wires had cooked that connector causing the connection to be intermittent.
As a test you could certainly connect those two White/Red wires together at the generator or that connector which would bypass remote switch and fire system then see if the unit will start.

 

[John E3]

Thanks. In my case I'm replacing a BCGTC with a BCGB and they are connected to the boat very differently. The BCGTC was working, but it had a giant hole in the block where a connecting rod tried to escape. Holding the On switch in the ON position allowed it to run, bypassing the lack of oil pressure. So, there is no issue with the boat as wired. (as purchased - seller said he was using it in the past, and knew nothing about a thrown rod - whole other topic!)
If I knew what the Violet wire's purpose was, that would be helpful. Since the 2 halon wires are direct connected to the 2 Generator wires in the System Monitor, and the Violet one can't can found at the genset, it's a quandary. The other wire goes to the aux oil pressure switch, so it's purpose is clear - it signals the System Monitor of Oil Pressure loss (the primary would shutdown the genset at the same time, so a bit redundant), but why it connects to the Halon system makes no sense.
The BCGB control panel is nearly identical to the BCGTC, but the 5 extra wires in the BCGTC don't correlate to any drawing of each generator. The only difference I see is how the choke solenoid is energized.
The later version of our boat, 380AC, has a genset drawing that looks like the BCGTC terminal block connected to the BCGB style 15 pin connector, but it uses 2 switches, and no Monoplex.
I have have decades of electronics & electrical background, and this has me baffled. Mostly due to a lack of correlation between the boat and the published wiring diagrams.
I think getting into the harness, and tracing wires, may be my only option at this point.