Hello all, I am, the new owner of a 280 DA, we downsized from a 300. My new 280 is a 2005, has twin 4.3l engines with Alpha 1 gen 2 counter rotating drives. The previous owner had for a year, and had a survey done. On that survey, it was noted that the rev limiter was reached at 5000 RPMs when fully throttle. My mechanic noted it during my sea trial, and of course, I am experiencing it now using the boat. All have said I need to change the props, perhaps to a 19P. I currently have the Vengeance 17P props that are original to the boat. I also verified that these are the original props see ray put on via the part number. So my question is does nthis make sense to any other owners? Why would the original props hit the rev limiter? The enginmes run grate otherwise. 240 hours on each. I am used to BIII drives so this is all new to me. Also, I have noticed once I am up on plane, and try to trim out the motors, if I go more than 1 or 2 trims up, the RPMs start to rev high. Again, just looking for some insight before I invest in new props for the boat. I obviously want to get this right. I also notice that when I cruise at apporox 27 MPH, and I hovering around 4100 RPMs. I have been burning a lot of fuel, and that RPM seems high to me for that cruising speed. Again, p[lease forgive my ignorance, i am used to 350 MAGS with BIII motors. thanks again
280 Dancer Props
- Thread starter kozzy
- Start date
Hi there and congrats on the new boat! I have a 2004 280 with the same setup. I will qualify that I only ever got to WOT once a season, just to make sure the engines reach stated RPM max, however I can hopefully provide a little perspective. These boats don't like much drive trim at all, which you've observed. the faster you're going, the more trim it will handle, but there's a point at which you'll ventilate the props and the revs will increase, there isn't much wiggle room here.
I typically cruise at 35-3,600 RPM and in freshwater i'm doing at 32 mph at that RPM. As for changing props. the 17s are on my boat as well, and I would be concerned that getting up on plane would be a challenge with a 19p prop unless you run the boat very light all the time. The 19s certainly would give you more top end, and prevent hitting the limiter, but for what this boat is intended to do, I'd much prefer to have the low end grunt needed to pull out of the hole with a loaded boat.
My advice? Keep the throttles off the dash and sit back and enjoy the ride!
I typically cruise at 35-3,600 RPM and in freshwater i'm doing at 32 mph at that RPM. As for changing props. the 17s are on my boat as well, and I would be concerned that getting up on plane would be a challenge with a 19p prop unless you run the boat very light all the time. The 19s certainly would give you more top end, and prevent hitting the limiter, but for what this boat is intended to do, I'd much prefer to have the low end grunt needed to pull out of the hole with a loaded boat.
My advice? Keep the throttles off the dash and sit back and enjoy the ride!
Have you ever hit the REV limiter? I stay back off the throttles, but when im trying to get up on plane, once I plane out is where I tend to hit the limit. I dont want to have a better top end, but it seems I should be able to run WOT without hitting the limit, even though I wont be running that fast normally. Plus, 28 MPH at 4000 RPM seems a bit much to me, no?
Thanks for the advice on the trim. my old 300 with BIII I could trim out nicely, almost half way out. These Alphas I can hardly move at all..no likey
Thanks for the advice on the trim. my old 300 with BIII I could trim out nicely, almost half way out. These Alphas I can hardly move at all..no likey
Something seems off to me here, you shouldn't be hitting the limiter when you're getting up on top of the water like that. Are you sure that the drives are able to be trimmed down fully, and that they are "tucked in" when you're getting up? The 280 doesn't like any trim until you're north of 3300 rpm. Also, 4000 rpm and 28 mph seems considerably off. At that rpm I'm doing closer to 35 mph measured by GPS. I have the same power package and drives, generator, and this was last weekend with 3/4 fuel and full water, empty holding tank and 2 people on board.
When I run mine to WOT I have to trim the drives up to get to stated max and even then I can get them to about 4700, I've never hit the limiter
Yeah, they are tucked in...I agree, something does not seem right to me with these numbers. I have a generator as well. Unless my trim senders are off and not telling me correct readings, but this all seems odd. I am burning a lot of fuel as well...most likely since I am running at higher RPMS than I should.
Also, I had the engines checked out by the mercruiser mechanics before i bought the boat. They gave it a thumbs up..compression came back all good, codes, etc. Im starting to think its not a prop issue since these are the original OEM props, but im not sure where else to look. I had the props off to lube the shaft before I put in the water,, the hubs seemed OK, were not loose or spinning....engines only have 240 hours on them...Im going to do some more testing and get some more RPM and speed numbers and write them down and go from there I guess...
Stroh
Member
- Apr 12, 2015
- 60
- Boat Info
- 2008 280 Sundancer "Age of Aquarius" 496 Mag, DTS, Kohler gen
2006 Sundancer 240 "Toy Boat" Sold
- Engines
- 496 Mag, DTS, Bravo III
Another possibility for those "OEM" props is that the PO had them reworked by a prop shop. I would see about having them checked by a competent prop shop and see. By your description and IF the hubs are good (no slipping) your high revs/speed almost has to be propeller related. IE: https://propmd.com/resources/prop-basics/
Last edited:
Yes, I am thinking I need to pull the props and have them checked. I have not seen any evidence that they were work, or that the hubs are spun, maybe slipping? but not spun. I am no prop pro though. I am thinking I need to start with removing them and having them checked.
Maybe a silly question, but are your trim tabs up while you’re experiencing this? Just trying to narrow this down. Also, do both engines hit the limiter or just one? If it were prop hubs or couplers I would assume it would be one engine, not both. Also, something to try is to “ease” up on plane and see if it happens then.
well, good question on the trim tabs. I assume they are all the way up, as the retract when I turn the boat off, dont they? On my old boat they did, im assuming they do on this as well. And yes, I have hit the limiter on both engines, although it is happens more on the starboard engine
The factory installed trim tabs DO NOT auto retract. So if you are attempting to jump on plane with tabs down it could be forcing the stern of the boat up and causing cavitation of your props. Bring the tabs all the way up and try again, bu this very well may be your issue.
You mean bring the tabs so the boat is "bow up" that fully retracts them, correct? I know when I go " bow down" that gets me on plane faster...
It might be some of the issue, but I think there is more. I am actually pulling the boat from the water Sunday and taking the props off and bringing them in to get checked, The local guy is very good, after speaking with him, he believes it is a prop issue.
It might be some of the issue, but I think there is more. I am actually pulling the boat from the water Sunday and taking the props off and bringing them in to get checked, The local guy is very good, after speaking with him, he believes it is a prop issue.
- Jun 5, 2016
- 5,551
- Boat Info
- 410 Sundancer
2001
12" Axiom and 9" Axiom+ MFD
- Engines
- Cat 3126 V-Drives
How are you/your mechanic measuring RPM's? Are you sure your tachs are correct? Sea Ray tachs are notoriously inaccurate. There is a switch on the back of them labeled 4/6/8 corresponding to the # of cylinders. Pull the tachs, and rotate that switch a couple time and place back at 6.
You could also get a strobe tach on to confirm whats really going on at the flywheel.
You could also get a strobe tach on to confirm whats really going on at the flywheel.
well, I brought the props in to the local prop expert. He does not see any obvious issues. He is going to measure them. Hubs look good, not slipping. He said the boat is under propped, a sea ray 280, should be more like a 19P or 21P. He is now the third professional that has said I need a 19P. Also, the mercruiser website recommends the same in their prop selector, when I put in all the information. The prop guy is going to add more "CUP". Ill see what that does, the next step if it dont work is to contact BBLADES, do the testing, and try some 19Ps.
OK, got the props back. much, much better. They were both unbalanced, and needed some work. Needless to say, if I hammer down, and push the throttles all they way down, I eventually hit the rev limiter. 4960 RPMS and 40.8 MPH via GPS. Still shouldn't do that. I am going to try 4 blade props at this point on someones recommendation, if they dont work, ill go to 19P Vengance SS props. These 2 types seem to be what all the pros are recommending to me. I still dont understand why the 17P that sea ray puts on the boat all are no longer working out for me. I cant imagine the original purchaser dealing with this in a brand new boat. But all the experts agree, my boat is under propped.
Tom MK
New Member
FWIW I just took ownership of a 2005 280DA with the same motors and generator and 17P (vengeance 48-16314 & 48-16315 17P) on both drives 110 hours on both motors. Thanks for the discussion very helpful info for me as well, and nice to know I'm not the only new 280DA owner.
At WOT I was getting around 4500 rpm and 34-38 mph. I'm on a plane around 3500 at 24 mph.
My drives had lots of galvanic corosion as the po forgot about the boat and didn't change zincs. The mechanic thought the props were aftermarket and thinks the issue was disimilar metals and I should get Aluminum props. First thing I did (during hull survey) was to add new zincs.
Sounds like it might be worth my time and money to get the props cleaned up and balanced as well.
Again thanks for the info.
At WOT I was getting around 4500 rpm and 34-38 mph. I'm on a plane around 3500 at 24 mph.
My drives had lots of galvanic corosion as the po forgot about the boat and didn't change zincs. The mechanic thought the props were aftermarket and thinks the issue was disimilar metals and I should get Aluminum props. First thing I did (during hull survey) was to add new zincs.
Sounds like it might be worth my time and money to get the props cleaned up and balanced as well.
Again thanks for the info.
well, you are the second person with a similar setup to me and not having prop issues. I keep being told every boat is different. I just got some 4 blade aluminum , recommended by my mechanic. I am going to try them out this week and see what happens. He will take them back if I dont like them, so I have nothing to lose, especially at 150 each. If they dont work, I am going to the Vengeance 19P SS props, those were the recommended props from the mercruiser prop selector, and from the prop guy that worked on the 17s I have now. I think I am also getting on plane around 24 MPH, but I think my RPMS are more like 3800. Ill be doing more testing when I get back up to the river on Thursday
Tom MK
New Member
FWIW I called Sea Ray yesterday and they confirmed that my original config was with those two vengeance 17p props.
Kozzy -- Can you share the specs on those aluminum props and how your tests work out. My mechanic is pushing me to go alum to avoid dissimilar metals.
Also I did a bunch of WOT this weekend and didn't get above 4500 rpm. I was in about 1' chop.
Kozzy -- Can you share the specs on those aluminum props and how your tests work out. My mechanic is pushing me to go alum to avoid dissimilar metals.
Also I did a bunch of WOT this weekend and didn't get above 4500 rpm. I was in about 1' chop.