420/44 DB Owners Club

[Alex F]

Do most of you keep and use the oil jugs on the Starboard side? I found out the previous owner never used them and had no idea how old the oil was.

I would like to use the space for the watermaker motor and pump.

How much oil do you typically carry on board?

I carry 2-3 gal of engine oil, 1+ for trainies, 1g of coolant, plus oils for the tender. I've always used the empty 2x2.5g cans. I find it very convenient and good spot for storing those cans.

If I was to install a water-maker, I'm not sure that behind the exhaust pipe is the best spot, due to limited access for service.

 

[AEO]

I carry 2-3 gal of engine oil, 1+ for trainies, 1g of coolant, plus oils for the tender. I've always used the empty 2x2.5g cans. I find it very convenient and good spot for storing those cans.

If I was to install a water-maker, I'm not sure that behind the exhaust pipe is the best spot, due to limited access for service.

I installed a Rainmaker Watermaker. Filters are on the forward bulkhead.

 

[AEO]

Just blacked out the flybridge window vertical frames to give it the one-piece look.

 

[ttmott]

I installed a Rainmaker Watermaker. Filters are on the forward bulkhead.

View attachment 133572 View attachment 133573

That's pretty cool; what a clean engine room you have!
Does that single motor for the watermaker do both the low pressure raw water feed as well as the high pressure to the membrane?

 

[AEO]

That's pretty cool; what a clean engine room you have!
Does that single motor for the watermaker do both the low pressure raw water feed as well as the high pressure to the membrane?

Thanks. Not sure about the answers to your questions - It’s one of these: https://www.rainmandesal.com/ac-electric-watermaker/

 

[ttmott]

Thanks. Not sure about the answers to your questions - It’s one of these: https://www.rainmandesal.com/ac-electric-watermaker/

Captured this image from their web page - It does, single electric motor does low and high pressure (high pressure left and feed pump right. My system which is larger (750 GPD) has to start the feed pump and have pressure to the HP pump before it will start - two large motors. The Rainmaker seems to be quite innovative and compact.

 

[techmitch]

Related RO dimensions
– High Output: 1,180 x 250 x 130mm (46.5 x 9.8 x 5.1″)
Amazing! This changes everything.

 

[AEO]

Related RO dimensions
– High Output: 1,180 x 250 x 130mm (46.5 x 9.8 x 5.1″)
Amazing! This changes everything.

I can attest to its reliability and ease of use. And very cheap. I paid just under $5k for it.

No new holes in the hull either, we just tapped into existing through hulls and also tapped into my water tanks fill hose. Easy installation.

Now we use as much water as we like whenever we like !

 

[Alex F]

I can attest to its reliability and ease of use. And very cheap. I paid just under $5k for it.

No new holes in the hull either, we just tapped into existing through hulls and also tapped into my water tanks fill hose. Easy installation.

Now we use as much water as we like whenever we like !

Very nice installation. I've noticed your tap to the A/C intake. I wonder if this isn't restricting the flow to the A/C pump.

I'm also used to see at 2-3 filters on the intake side. You have only one. I wonder what's the trick there.

 

[AEO]

Very nice installation. I've noticed your tap to the A/C intake. I wonder if this isn't restricting the flow to the A/C pump.

I'm also used to see at 2-3 filters on the intake side. You have only one. I wonder what's the trick there.

You have made some great observations. I haven’t noticed any issues with the A/C so I’m assuming the filter can handle it. I’d be interested to know how many A/C’s you can operate using the one pump and filter.

On the upside, I don’t use the water maker that often - perhaps 1 hour every 3 days.

As for the filters, as far as I’m aware it’s an ex factory installation.

 

[Irie308]

You have made some great observations. I haven’t noticed any issues with the A/C so I’m assuming the filter can handle it. I’d be interested to know how many A/C’s you can operate using the one pump and filter.

On the upside, I don’t use the water maker that often - perhaps 1 hour every 3 days.

As for the filters, as far as I’m aware it’s an ex factory installation.

Was going to ask the same. Very interested in this as a diy project. We spend a lot of time on the hook and my daughter recently mentioned she doesn't love it as much as she is not a fan of how we have to conserve water while on the hook. Doing my best to keep them engaged as long as possible. Curious how you access the freshwater fill line. Haven't looked for it yet but is it accessible from behind the sofa seatback?

 

[ttmott]

Was going to ask the same. Very interested in this as a diy project. We spend a lot of time on the hook and my daughter recently mentioned she doesn't love it as much as she is not a fan of how we have to conserve water while on the hook. Doing my best to keep them engaged as long as possible. Curious how you access the freshwater fill line. Haven't looked for it yet but is it accessible from behind the sofa seatback?

@AEO I have some direct experience on this. My watermaker shares the bridge AC seacock. I tried combined and shortly noticed that the watermaker will draw the prime from the AC pump and eventually start drawing air then the watermaker pump will not pump and it shuts down. Here is how I ended up fixing the problem, a 3-way valve -

 

[AEO]

@AEO I have some direct experience on this. My watermaker shares the bridge AC seacock. I tried combined and shortly noticed that the watermaker will draw the prime from the AC pump and eventually start drawing air then the watermaker pump will not pump and it shuts down. Here is how I ended up fixing the problem, a 3-way valve -
View attachment 133648

I haven’t experienced anything like that yet but I’ll certainly keep an eye out next time I’m running both the AC and the watermaker.

 

[ttmott]

I haven’t experienced anything like that yet but I’ll certainly keep an eye out next time I’m running both the AC and the watermaker.

In my case the issue was when the AC was not running at the same time - the Watermaker pulled the prime from the AC system. Plus when that happens the AC won't work and needs to be re-primed.

 

[AEO]

In my case the issue was when the AC was not running at the same time - the Watermaker pulled the prime from the AC system. Plus when that happens the AC won't work and needs to be re-primed.

Good point. I had mine installed professionally so I’ll check to see if they fitted a check valve in the AC pump cct. I’ve definitely run the watermaker with the AC not running without any issues. (fingers crossed emoji)

 

[Alex F]

You have made some great observations. I haven’t noticed any issues with the A/C so I’m assuming the filter can handle it. I’d be interested to know how many A/C’s you can operate using the one pump and filter.

On the upside, I don’t use the water maker that often - perhaps 1 hour every 3 days.

As for the filters, as far as I’m aware it’s an ex factory installation.

The key part, as Tom mentioned from his experience, is that you have a single point of raw water supply via A/C seastrainer, which your installer also hooked up the watermaker. Now you have two different systems "fighting" for the raw water supply.

When you say "...I’d be interested to know how many A/C’s you can operate using the one pump and filter...", you're getting slightly off track here. On one side you have your A/C pump, which feeds at least two A/C units (Salon and the staterooms). If you have bridge A/C, then you probably have a monster pump (which is the case in my installation), that feeds all 3 A/C units. In my case, the A/C pump is demands a lot of water and generates pressure as strong as the city water or even stronger.

Now, on the other side, is your watermaker components that include another pretty high demand pump and the filter (on the intake raw water side).

So, in reality, when both systems (A/C and the watermaker) kick off, those two high demanding pumps are fighting to grab whatever water supply they can, from the 1" ID hose. What happens in these situations is that something has to give and one of the systems is starting to struggle. For example, the A/Cs system is not circulating adequate amount of water, so the A/Cs are getting much warmer water through, which is affecting their performance. If the A/C pump has more power, then the watermaker pump is going to starve eventually and the watermaker pump might start overheating.

I haven't done any calculations, so I can't tell you how much your systems are impacted by this type of installation. But, I think the installers were betting that both systems would not be on at the same time, for a long period of time. I can see how this could marginally work in NE, but in warmer climate, the A/Cs run 24/7. IMO, that's very risky bet and Tom's case scenario shows what the reality has proved. The only way to ensure proper operation of either system, you need a selector valve to make the choice which system will get the water supply at any given time.

I don't want to scare you, but rather give you a fair warning that you need to keep a close eye on both of your systems and understand how to read the early warning signs. Better yet, start switching into more of a pro-active approach and look into doing similar selector valve as Tom did. Then, you'll have 100% control over the systems and you'll know what to run and when. Otherwise, I'd recommend looking into installing dedicated seacock with a strainer for the watermaker.

 

[Alex F]

@AEO I have some direct experience on this. My watermaker shares the bridge AC seacock. I tried combined and shortly noticed that the watermaker will draw the prime from the AC pump and eventually start drawing air then the watermaker pump will not pump and it shuts down. Here is how I ended up fixing the problem, a 3-way valve -
View attachment 133648

Tom,
That's a pretty neat mod. What's that looks like a zinc head in the center of the strainer cap? Is it really a zinc or just a plug for a flushing system?

I hope that's an old pic, b/c you're missing 2nd hose clamp on the A/C output side. I don't think you'd keep a single there intentionally. ......BTW, I'd put double clamp on the watermaker output side as well. I see that there isn't much real estate there, but I'd try fitting two somehow.

 

[ttmott]

Tom,
That's a pretty neat mod. What's that looks like a zinc head in the center of the strainer cap? Is it really a zinc or just a plug for a flushing system?

I hope that's an old pic, b/c you're missing 2nd hose clamp on the A/C output side. I don't think you'd keep a single there intentionally. ......BTW, I'd put double clamp on the watermaker output side as well. I see that there isn't much real estate there, but I'd try fitting two somehow.

No that's just a plug, no real function. The pumps are actually above the seawater level so no need for double clamps; actually I'm re-thinking the double clamping in general except for what the requirements demand.

 

[Bruce SEA 993]

Thanks for all the great replies and info. We just got back from 2 weeks out and have a few non-boat things to do and then I will start the install.

Seawater Pro is the unit I bought and the previous owner tore out an older watermaker that needed "a bunch of expensive work". I think it used proprietary filters. The nice thing is there is a through hull and a strainer all ready for me.

One of the first tasks is to get the 110V power to the engine room. I will run an additional circuit for the engine room heater that I want to get in before it gets cold here. ER heaters are enough for our winters.

Cheers!

 

[Garymarel1]

I have a whine on my port main did you find a reason why?

Ok thank you