John E3
Active Member
Run it till its obvious its done, or sold it by then. I guess we'll see.
Potential Engine Pull Out
- Thread starter John E3
- Start date
Run it till its obvious its done, or sold it by then. I guess we'll see.
John E3
Active Member
New heads on the way from Crate Engine Depot. 12562920 with casting number 12562925, matching the 14097088 pretty much identically. Found 2 rockers with excess wear on the valve stem. OEM rocker, $120 each, full set of stamped style for this exact motor $100. I'll get them on and then measure lash and replace push rods as/if needed. And inspect lifters while I'm in there.
I have the service manual, and following that assembly guidance. Any words of wisdom from the more mechanical than I?
My BIL was a lead Lexus mechanic for a good 20 years, but not much of a 454 guy. My nephew has a 94 370SB with carb'd up versions, and lots of engine background, so he's got some favorite products.
I have the service manual, and following that assembly guidance. Any words of wisdom from the more mechanical than I?
My BIL was a lead Lexus mechanic for a good 20 years, but not much of a 454 guy. My nephew has a 94 370SB with carb'd up versions, and lots of engine background, so he's got some favorite products.
keep a light oil on the piston rings; Kroil is what I use and oil down the camshaft with engine oil so it doesn't pit.
John E3
Active Member
The cam area is still wet with oil, covered with shop towels and the wind pan. I'm going to pull each lifter for inspection when the heads go on. I'm away till then anyway.
I used a shop vac on the block face, and piston groove as I turned the engine, wiping each cylinder each time I stopped for a piston head. I then sprayed fogging oil on all the pistons and walls, turned it a few more times to get an remaining residue and wiped the excess over the face, and covered in shop towels.
Now it sits till I have heads. Hopefully on Tuesday.
It looked much more dauting when I started, but damn, other than the 3 hrs of beating and prying to get the 1 manifold off, it isn't that bad of a job. Parts are a little heavy for 1 person though! The next step, the block, would have but a real damper on things, bringing me back to where I started, pulling it out! Hopefully I still have some years left in the block. Yeah some water intrusion blemishes, but the 170psi readings are promising. A little oil use, some extra blow by. No vertical scores visible anywhere thankfully.
Assuming I don't have intrusion issues on the stbd side, it'll go super easy compared to this one. But that's a fall task.
John E3
Active Member
Regarding the rockers, you can't by a full set with the shoulder studs (that I've found). What are the chances that standard stamped steel rockers would be the same as these? I'd really like to stick with the non-adjustable design.
John E3
Active Member
John E3
Active Member
Build did not go to plan. Got both heads and intake on, no issues. Did a compression test and 1 cylinder was only 90psi, vs 170 on the rest (same as when I started). Tried a squirt of oil (this one tested 170 originally) with no change. Put it at TDC and applied some air pressure, and there was a distinct hiss deep inside. Something did not seal properly on this cylinder. I pulled the head and found nothing notable. The only thing even remotely visible was a seemingly light contact mark between the cylinder and a water passage. Most other areas seemed to show pretty uniform contact. I had no issues with the torque process. Snugged with a socket, then 3 steps to the final setting. I even did another check pass when doing the air test to see if it changed. It did not.
I'm suspicious I may not have cleaned the blocked sufficiently, and didn't get a uniform contact. I cleaned the block and head off using a tool I recently picked up for a totally different project, a babbitt scraper. This works amazingly well cleaning the surfaces without any scratches. I ran a large file across the block face and didn't find anything significant, but I did get some clear fresh metal near the block edges, in the vicinity of this cylinder. I did 'miss' setting this head in place, and the end with the leak was the end that missed the locator post. I did not see anything in the way of damage to the gasket, compressed spot, dent, crease, etc.
Any suggestions on what else to look for while wait for new gaskets?
Pbly more than a dozen marinas within 15 miles, 4 auto parts stores, and apparently no-one sells marine gaskets. Given the BBC popularity in boats I was a bit surprised.
Launch slipping another week. The yard is not liking the idea of a tow to the slip as their tow boat is not suited for a 38ft wind screen, followed by "it ran great when we brought it over to haul" says the yard manager (and previous owner!). The yard and marina are on different points, and our slip is as far from the yard as possible, so I can understand the concern. I don't need it beached with the tow boat on the far side of the creek!
I'm suspicious I may not have cleaned the blocked sufficiently, and didn't get a uniform contact. I cleaned the block and head off using a tool I recently picked up for a totally different project, a babbitt scraper. This works amazingly well cleaning the surfaces without any scratches. I ran a large file across the block face and didn't find anything significant, but I did get some clear fresh metal near the block edges, in the vicinity of this cylinder. I did 'miss' setting this head in place, and the end with the leak was the end that missed the locator post. I did not see anything in the way of damage to the gasket, compressed spot, dent, crease, etc.
Any suggestions on what else to look for while wait for new gaskets?
Pbly more than a dozen marinas within 15 miles, 4 auto parts stores, and apparently no-one sells marine gaskets. Given the BBC popularity in boats I was a bit surprised.
Launch slipping another week. The yard is not liking the idea of a tow to the slip as their tow boat is not suited for a 38ft wind screen, followed by "it ran great when we brought it over to haul" says the yard manager (and previous owner!). The yard and marina are on different points, and our slip is as far from the yard as possible, so I can understand the concern. I don't need it beached with the tow boat on the far side of the creek!
John E3
Active Member
It seems that I've missed an update or 5.....
Got the new heads on, and fully reassembled, without any major drama. I did a rough set on the timing, bled the fuel rail, and hit the remote starter and in literally a few revolutions it fired off and startled me enough to drop the timing light. Shutdown, gathered my self up and got the timing dialed in a little closer. I don't have any background on a big block, so not sure if it sounds right. At this point there was no water in anything (or the "fan" belt driving pumps), so I ran it only 30ish seconds at a time. All seemed well, so I filled it with water (just for more testing) and connected a hose to the seawater inlet and fired it up. Ran slow for about minutes and everything seemed to be in order.
We launched a few days later, 5+ min cruise to slip, and relief. I did more extensive evaluation and got the Axiom MFD configured to display all the engine data. The only difference noted was in oil pressure. This one maxes out at just about 34psi, stbd is around 46. We went out Saturday, idled up the creek or a little shake down, and then headed for Gratitude for gas. Filled up and ventured on. All still looking, and sounding, good. Ramped it up to around 2000 rpm for a bit, all good. Pushed it to 3600 and ran down close to Love Point and then back to the marina. We ran about 3600 for 45 minutes. Temps creeped up close to 170 (160 tstats), and OP stayed at 35/46. Reported fuel consumption was nearly identical between the 2 engines.
The only visual indicator I saw was clearly visible steam from stbd exhaust, and nothing from port. This makes me nervous that the stbd has a water leak into the exhaust, as port did. I was suspicious of this already. Speaking of that, when I loaded up the old castings for recycling I found a huge open channel from water jacket to exhaust port on the riser face of the manifold. Easily 1/4" x 2" long. No clue why I hadn't noticed that before.
I added Marvel Mystery Oil and Lucas Upper end fuel additive to both engines, hopefully for a little better performance, and maybe help that low compression cylinder.
Got the new heads on, and fully reassembled, without any major drama. I did a rough set on the timing, bled the fuel rail, and hit the remote starter and in literally a few revolutions it fired off and startled me enough to drop the timing light. Shutdown, gathered my self up and got the timing dialed in a little closer. I don't have any background on a big block, so not sure if it sounds right. At this point there was no water in anything (or the "fan" belt driving pumps), so I ran it only 30ish seconds at a time. All seemed well, so I filled it with water (just for more testing) and connected a hose to the seawater inlet and fired it up. Ran slow for about minutes and everything seemed to be in order.
We launched a few days later, 5+ min cruise to slip, and relief. I did more extensive evaluation and got the Axiom MFD configured to display all the engine data. The only difference noted was in oil pressure. This one maxes out at just about 34psi, stbd is around 46. We went out Saturday, idled up the creek or a little shake down, and then headed for Gratitude for gas. Filled up and ventured on. All still looking, and sounding, good. Ramped it up to around 2000 rpm for a bit, all good. Pushed it to 3600 and ran down close to Love Point and then back to the marina. We ran about 3600 for 45 minutes. Temps creeped up close to 170 (160 tstats), and OP stayed at 35/46. Reported fuel consumption was nearly identical between the 2 engines.
The only visual indicator I saw was clearly visible steam from stbd exhaust, and nothing from port. This makes me nervous that the stbd has a water leak into the exhaust, as port did. I was suspicious of this already. Speaking of that, when I loaded up the old castings for recycling I found a huge open channel from water jacket to exhaust port on the riser face of the manifold. Easily 1/4" x 2" long. No clue why I hadn't noticed that before.
I added Marvel Mystery Oil and Lucas Upper end fuel additive to both engines, hopefully for a little better performance, and maybe help that low compression cylinder.
- Jan 26, 2008
- 2,839
- Boat Info
- SOLD 2005 420 DA w/T-8.1S Horizons
- Engines
- 2018 Sea Hunt 255se w/Yamaha 300hp
Kinda of good news/bad news. At least now you know what you're up against on the stbd side. And once done, you're going to be mechanically golden for some time.
PlayDate
Well-Known Member
What was the issue with the number 1 cylinder? Glad you got it going.
John E3
Active Member
Spring start up: hydro locked. exhaust sea water leaked into exhaust, filled cyl #6. Leaked for years it turns out and rotted out the exhaust ports in the heads and left marks on 5 of 8 cylinder walls. Initially I found 190psi in the inboard cylinders (and same on outboard, later). After installing new heads I found only 90psi on #8. After much head scratching I figure I must have either failed to check that one, or somehow forgot? No clue, but it's 90, 95 with a spray of wd40. Assumed gasket or surface fail and pulled it apart only to find nothing, and no change on reassembly. Pressurizing it at top and bottom sounded the same, blowing deep inside, and creating mist in the crankcase. No obvious wear in the cylinder walls. Knowing the stbd is in similar state I decided to just run with it and do a short block in the near future. Maybe a longblock for stbd, depending on what I find under the manifolds. Ideally this fall/winter but the wallet is hurting already. We've only been out 4 times since we got it, mostly due to it being the perfect boat, but came along sooner than we were planning with other obligations (ie massive house renovation). We couldn't let it slip by, but no time for it till this season, then delayed way to long to get in!
Read on for some boat ramblings, if interested.
I "grew up" boating out of Worton Creek in the 70's but lived in NJ and Delaware River boating sucks (we were above Philly). This is the first I've been boating in my own boat on the Chesapeake in decades and it was off to a rocky start! Our first official outing for the season will be to a spot my entire extended family would even recognize, BBB. A family favorite for decades, long ago!
Ironically my nephew who was not yet around then, is selling his 370EC and buying an identical boat that we had back then, 1929 Elco Flat top cruiser. We had a 1928 that my father sold only 3 yrs ago (after 53 yrs) to a premier restorer in RI. It was 99% original (except engines). This 1929 may be the second most original one left, with a major advantage, it's hull was restored. My fathers needed all new framing, etc. And, it's cruise ready with older system installs, you know, like AC. (he just did major updates on the 370EC!) Windows open at 9kn is all we had back in the day! The selling of my fathers elco was amazingly hard on my kids generation, especially my nephew, even though not one ever rode in it. Technically our daughter did, but she wasn't born till 4 months later. That was one of the last outings. It mostly just moved between marinas for a few years before haul out. It was on my fathers property, probably close to 20 years, so they grew up "on it", sort of. Just ignore the workshop around it. Ramble off.
Read on for some boat ramblings, if interested.
I "grew up" boating out of Worton Creek in the 70's but lived in NJ and Delaware River boating sucks (we were above Philly). This is the first I've been boating in my own boat on the Chesapeake in decades and it was off to a rocky start! Our first official outing for the season will be to a spot my entire extended family would even recognize, BBB. A family favorite for decades, long ago!
Ironically my nephew who was not yet around then, is selling his 370EC and buying an identical boat that we had back then, 1929 Elco Flat top cruiser. We had a 1928 that my father sold only 3 yrs ago (after 53 yrs) to a premier restorer in RI. It was 99% original (except engines). This 1929 may be the second most original one left, with a major advantage, it's hull was restored. My fathers needed all new framing, etc. And, it's cruise ready with older system installs, you know, like AC. (he just did major updates on the 370EC!) Windows open at 9kn is all we had back in the day! The selling of my fathers elco was amazingly hard on my kids generation, especially my nephew, even though not one ever rode in it. Technically our daughter did, but she wasn't born till 4 months later. That was one of the last outings. It mostly just moved between marinas for a few years before haul out. It was on my fathers property, probably close to 20 years, so they grew up "on it", sort of. Just ignore the workshop around it. Ramble off.
John E3
Active Member
Update, smooth "sailing" so far. We've done 4 trips, 2+hrs runtime roundtrip on each. The only point I've noted is that the Engine Gateways report fuel consumption on Port (the rebuild) is a tiny bit higher. Oil pressure is also much lower than Stbd, 32 vs 45. I have not yet checked on the compression in cylinder 8 to see if it's come up. I need to bring some ear plugs with me while I sit between them, at 3800, looking at the crankcase vent tube at the air intake screen to see if there is any obvious blow by. They are LOUD!
I have not pushed to WOT to see what the differences may be there. Not sure I want to!
3800 seems to be a sweet spot around 17nmph. Below 16nmph and we loose the plane and falls to 12nmph fast, at only about 100rpm drop. About 9nmph seems to be the low cruise sweet spot. It did creep up to about 4000, and 20nmph at one point, probably an overshoot getting up on a plane.
And if you followed my BCBG generator thread, it's working well too. It did give me a hard time over the weekend, at anchor. It fired up on the first try the night before (warm engine room), but took like 10 tries before it would stay running (hot engine room) the next day. It ran quiet as can be for a couple hours, the first time we ran it this long, but only on a light load.
And in another thread, the new sealing nut on the port transmission output coupling is also looking good. I was worried that the "pre-load" on the bearing would be increased. Or more correctly, it now exists! The old nut was loose, so the coupling was not compressing the bearings. No leak and no noise. I found 7qts of trans oil containers (almost empty gallon, + 3 full qts) and stop leak onboard. Visible oil in bilge dripping from coupling. I initially thought it was the seal, till I split the couplings and 4oz of oil poured out and the seal was dry.
I have not pushed to WOT to see what the differences may be there. Not sure I want to!
3800 seems to be a sweet spot around 17nmph. Below 16nmph and we loose the plane and falls to 12nmph fast, at only about 100rpm drop. About 9nmph seems to be the low cruise sweet spot. It did creep up to about 4000, and 20nmph at one point, probably an overshoot getting up on a plane.
And if you followed my BCBG generator thread, it's working well too. It did give me a hard time over the weekend, at anchor. It fired up on the first try the night before (warm engine room), but took like 10 tries before it would stay running (hot engine room) the next day. It ran quiet as can be for a couple hours, the first time we ran it this long, but only on a light load.
And in another thread, the new sealing nut on the port transmission output coupling is also looking good. I was worried that the "pre-load" on the bearing would be increased. Or more correctly, it now exists! The old nut was loose, so the coupling was not compressing the bearings. No leak and no noise. I found 7qts of trans oil containers (almost empty gallon, + 3 full qts) and stop leak onboard. Visible oil in bilge dripping from coupling. I initially thought it was the seal, till I split the couplings and 4oz of oil poured out and the seal was dry.
