TILT/TRIM NOT GOING ALL THE WAY DOWN

[Steve255AJ]

Okay, I'm back with another "small" problem with my 255 AJ
Everyone here has been very helpful in the past and helped me with resto questions, boat is coming along nicely, thanks to everyone.
July fourth weekend the starter was acting up, I had to keep hitting it with a rubber mallet to get it to start. So I decided to replace it, not so easy I found out (LOL), I had to hoist the engine up to get at it!
Long story less long, I decided, While I had the engine up, to replace the trim pump, hydraulic lines that go under the engine from the trim pump, the valve block at the bottom of the stern drive, the hydraulic lines that go to the trim cylinders and the cylinders themselves. Basically the entire trim system.
I got everything replaced and back together and everything is working perfectly.
Incidentally, the superseded part number for the starter from SeaRay is wrong. I found the exact same part at Advanced auto parts for 1/4 the cost.
I bled the trim system and it works BUT my problem is that it goes down a little LESS each time I put it down. So the result is that the propeller is not where it should be and is trimming the bow up. Each time I use the boat I have to slightly open up the hydraulic lines at the valve block and stand on the stern drive to bleed it down to the full down position then close the lines. Then when I put the boat in the water I lower the drive and it goes all the way down but if I trim up to go close to the beach and then try to put it down it doesn't quite go all the way down and each time it goes up and down it goes less and less down as if it's air bound or something.
I've tried bleeding over and over and still have the same problem. I'm not sure what is causing this issue.
Anyone have any ideas?

 

[Lazy Daze]

There's three likely scenarios that I can think of off the top of my head. A problem with the valve block, a problem with the internal bushings in the hyd rams or simply that the system isn't fully bled, yet. Start with the latter. First, DON'T keep opening up the system - every time you do that you're letting air back into it. You may have to go full up and full down a couple dozen times while monitoring the reservoir.

FYI, regarding the starter (or similar things in the future)... you should be looking at Merc parts/catalogs, not Sea Ray. These are engine parts and actually have nothing to do with the boat. Also, if you're not buying from a local company/Merc dealer, make sure you're looking at reputable online sources. If not, you may get the wrong part. Concerning buying from auto parts stores... MAKE SURE IT IS "marine" with the proper SAE rating otherwise it may cause an explosion. And... I suppose this is too late, but if it's not pre-painted like the Merc starter, you may want to give it a really good paint job to help stave off rusting.

 

[techmitch]

There's three likely scenarios that I can think of off the top of my head. A problem with the valve block, a problem with the internal bushings in the hyd rams or simply that the system isn't fully bled, yet. Start with the latter. First, DON'T keep opening up the system - every time you do that you're letting air back into it. You may have to go full up and full down a couple dozen times while monitoring the reservoir.

FYI, regarding the starter (or similar things in the future)... you should be looking at Merc parts/catalogs, not Sea Ray. These are engine parts and actually have nothing to do with the boat. Also, if you're not buying from a local company/Merc dealer, make sure you're looking at reputable online sources. If not, you may get the wrong part. Concerning buying from auto parts stores... MAKE SURE IT IS "marine" with the proper SAE rating otherwise it may cause an explosion. And... I suppose this is too late, but if it's not pre-painted like the Merc starter, you may want to give it a really good paint job to help stave off rusting.

+1 on what Dennis says. Also. don't forget to use the trailer button so you trim the drive to the actual "full up" position each time you cycle it up and down.

 

[Lazy Daze]

+1 on what Dennis says. Also. don't forget to use the trailer button so you trim the drive to the actual "full up" position each time you cycle it up and down.

Good point, Mitch.

Also... "monitoring the reservoir"... if you're seeing a lot of bubbles, you should let them settle out before continuing.

 

[scoflaw]

To properly bleed that system you have to take the rams off the transom assembly and position them vertically with the lines upward

 

[Steve255AJ]

Thank you for the ideas on a solution.
I will try bleeding the system by raising and lowering the drive several times. Honestly I've only moved it up and down maybe 4 or 5 times in a row to bleed so maybe I need to do this more. I've owned other boats but never a stern drive so still learning about them.
I am taking the boat out this Sunday so I will get up early and bleed the system again and I will be sure to monitor the fluid level. Yes, I already made the rookie mistake of filling it with the drive up, LOL. Luckily only a few ounces of oil spilled.
Dennis, can you elaborate on the valve block concern? The valve block is new and I checked for leaks and it is good. What could be wrong with it? Likewise with the rams, they are brand new as well.

Incidentally, regarding the starter part #. I knew it was a Merc part but was having trouble finding the correct starter so I called Hyannis Marina, on Cape Cod, where I used to work many years ago, they are a SeaRay dealer, and spoke with the parts manager. He looked it up and gave me a superseded Mercruiser part #. I ordered the part for $395 and it showed up. The bolt pattern was correct BUT nothing else about it was. It was 1/3 the size of the old starter and the support bracket in the back did not fit and most importantly there were 2 additional teeth on the gear so I knew it wouldn't work. I sent it back and they did refund me. Like I said I was able to find the precise replacement by googling "1985 chevy 350 starter" and BAM, there it was, in stock at Advanced Auto parts, the exact starter I needed! I didn't paint it but I did use a thin film of grease all over it and greased the gear very well. I felt in a fresh water only application it should be okay. At any rate, I didn't have a choice. Installed it and turned the key, BOOM, she started up like brand new, so I was happy with that and only $110 to boot.
I'll let you know how it goes Sunday, Thanks again for all your help.
Steve.

 

[Nater Potater]

I will try bleeding the system by raising and lowering the drive several times. Honestly I've only moved it up and down maybe 4 or 5 times in a row to bleed so maybe I need to do this more.

Maybe 4 or 5 hundred times! They're a pain. And, like @techmitch mentioned, be sure to run them their full travel each time. It'll happen.

I was able to find the precise replacement by googling "1985 chevy 350 starter" and BAM, there it was, in stock at Advanced Auto parts, the exact starter I needed!

True, they're "just" Chevy parts, but anything on a boat that could produce a spark (distributor, alternator, starter, solenoids, blowers, et al) needs to be rated "Ignition Protected". Unlike a car that is open below the engine, any fumes from fuel are going to pool down in the bilge, just waiting for a reason to explode.

Installed it and turned the key, BOOM...

Yeah, probably shouldn't say "boom" when you're talking boats...

 

[Lazy Daze]

I mentioned those possible culprits simply as "possbilities". But bleeding properly... not just "several" times, as I mentioned... is most likely the issue.

Also, as I noted (and Nater properly pointed out)... you NEED a MARINE starter. You searched for "Chevy"... of course you found it. But it sounds like you found an automotive starter. As we've said, that is NOT safe. REMOVE it and get the proper one. I'm not sure what happend with Hyannis, but you may have just gotten the wrong one. Sometimes, there are two different starters used during an enginge model year. It's important to use your serial number and also visually verify.

Steve, if you haven't yet picked up what we're laying down... DO NOT USE ANYTHING BUT A MARINE STARTER. You may not get a second chance at this... and, unfortunately, you wouldn't be the first... or the last.

I don't mean to sound crass, but it seems like you're glossing over what we're saying and this truly is a serious matter. Try this - listen to what we're saying (do your own research if you want) and then talk about this with your family. See what they think.

 

[Bill Curtis]

On your starter replacement, it's not a fresh water VS salt water issue. The issue is "ignition protection", meaning the sparks from the starter brushes will ignite gasoline fumes in the bilge. KABOOM.... game over. Too many boats (and lives) lost every year from that single factor.

Numerous videos on You Tube will show what happens when gas vapors ignite. Usually at a fueling dock.

Ignition protected parts will not allow any sparks inside to ignite fuel vapors outside.

I would not touch the starter switch until that starter is removed and replaced with a protected part.

The marine ones are more expensive, but there is a serious safety reason for it.