Village idiot and the hatch lift from hell

Steve500dancer

Steve500dancer

Member
Jul 13, 2009
868
Franklin Tennessee (Nashville area)
Boat Info
1996 500 sundancer
2001 340 sundancer sold
2001 270 Rinker sold
1996 240 sundancer sold
Engines
Twin 6v92 Detroit deisels
A few weeks ago my hatch lift stopped working. I replaced the switch and still nothing. I tested the switch and everything at the motor was lighting up when I tested it. In the up position it would light the red wire and down it would light the yellow wire. With that information I removed the hatch lift. Not an easy task.I took it to a fella that was going to remove the motor and have it repaired. After a week or so he could not get the motor off the actuator. He tested it and said it was froze up I posted, I called, I searched and posted and called some more. Sea Ray wanted $812.00 for the actuator. I found one on e-bay on Thursday and bid on it. I decided to go to the docks and pick up the old one to verify the measurements late Thursday night. I decided to test it myself just for the hell of it. I hooked it up to a battery and up she went then back down and back up. I could not believe my eyes. I thought that maybe it was jammed up and I got lucky. I took it apart on Friday afternoon and greased her up and tested it again. Yep.. up and down like it was new. Friday night I crawled down in the hatch and went for it. It was 100 degrees and as humid as I have ever felt it. I was dripping wet. I worked my ass off and got it back in. I had too get it done, I had 10 people coming out with me on Saturday morning. so I got it all hooked back up and sure as ****. My wife hit the button and nothing. I damn near crapped my pants. How is this even possible. what kind of idiot am I. I took out the test light and checked for power...Nothing...then power... then nothing again. every second or third time it would light up. I did get a little shock when I touched the actuator. I hooked up another hot wire and another ground wire off the battery and up she went. I reversed them and down she went. it was about 11:00 pm Friday when I decide to run a pair of wires from the battery and another pair of wires from the actuator motor. I ran them up into a storage area. I just cross the wires and she works like a dream. This stupid thing has to have a bad switch. I know damn well that the wires are correct on the switch. I can't think of anything other than the stupid switch being bad. What are the chances of getting a new switch that is bad? I do remember that when I got the switch it had popped apart and one of the springs popped out and I stuck it back in. I guess the switch has to be bad. Why did I only test it once before I took the actuator out... Yep I am Bone..Lord of the idiots.:smt021. tomorrow I will be on the telephone with Flounder pounder to oreder another switch. I can't wait to tear the dash panel out again and put a new switch in. Man that is fun. Almost as much fun as my Steroid injections I got in my neck last Monday.

Steve
 
steve340dancer said:
A few weeks ago my hatch lift stopped working. I replaced the switch and still nothing. I tested the switch and everything at the motor was lighting up when I tested it. In the up position it would light the red wire and down it would light the yellow wire. With that information I removed the hatch lift. Not an easy task.I took it to a fella that was going to remove the motor and have it repaired. After a week or so he could not get the motor off the actuator. He tested it and said it was froze up I posted, I called, I searched and posted and called some more. Sea Ray wanted $812.00 for the actuator. I found one on e-bay on Thursday and bid on it. I decided to go to the docks and pick up the old one to verify the measurements late Thursday night. I decided to test it myself just for the hell of it. I hooked it up to a battery and up she went then back down and back up. I could not believe my eyes. I thought that maybe it was jammed up and I got lucky. I took it apart on Friday afternoon and greased her up and tested it again. Yep.. up and down like it was new. Friday night I crawled down in the hatch and went for it. It was 100 degrees and as humid as I have ever felt it. I was dripping wet. I worked my ass off and got it back in. I had too get it done, I had 10 people coming out with me on Saturday morning. so I got it all hooked back up and sure as ****. My wife hit the button and nothing. I damn near crapped my pants. How is this even possible. what kind of idiot am I. I took out the test light and checked for power...Nothing...then power... then nothing again. every second or third time it would light up. I did get a little shock when I touched the actuator. I hooked up another hot wire and another ground wire off the battery and up she went. I reversed them and down she went. it was about 11:00 pm Friday when I decide to run a pair of wires from the battery and another pair of wires from the actuator motor. I ran them up into a storage area. I just cross the wires and she works like a dream. This stupid thing has to have a bad switch. I know damn well that the wires are correct on the switch. I can't think of anything other than the stupid switch being bad. What are the chances of getting a new switch that is bad? I do remember that when I got the switch it had popped apart and one of the springs popped out and I stuck it back in. I guess the switch has to be bad. Why did I only test it once before I took the actuator out... Yep I am Bone..Lord of the idiots.:smt021. tomorrow I will be on the telephone with Flounder pounder to oreder another switch. I can't wait to tear the dash panel out again and put a new switch in. Man that is fun. Almost as much fun as my Steroid injections I got in my neck last Monday.

Steve
Click to expand...



I REALLY FEEL YOUR PAIN, I TRULY HOPE THINGS WORK OUT:smt009:smt009:smt009
 
We had the same problem with the hatch lift on our 2004 300 not working. Found the EIM was bad and there wasn't anything wrong with the actuator or the switch. Still waiting on the new EIM ($490) from SeaRay.
The hatch was a major pain to lift manually and don't want to have to do that again. Planning on installing a second switch with hard wires in the event of another EIM failure.
Hopefully your problem will be eliminated with a new switch.
 
Just started having problems with my actuator yesterday... Hit the switch and nothing... I checked the breaker for power and it was good... I pulled the pin and manually raised the hatch... I twisted the actuator and it started to work again... I am looking for a spare now, so if anyone has one for sale, please tell me... Thanks...
 
rcknecht said:
Just started having problems with my actuator yesterday... Hit the switch and nothing... I checked the breaker for power and it was good... I pulled the pin and manually raised the hatch... I twisted the actuator and it started to work again... I am looking for a spare now, so if anyone has one for sale, please tell me... Thanks...
Click to expand...

Rod,
Have you considered taking the actuator to the shop that fixes alternators and starters? Just an idea.
 
The actuator is fine. The problem is somewhere between the switch and the wires that go to the actuator motor. I have tested the actuator 20 times and it is working like a champ

Thanks
Steve
 
steve340dancer said:
The actuator is fine. The problem is somewhere between the switch and the wires that go to the actuator motor. I have tested the actuator 20 times and it is working like a champ

Thanks
Steve
Click to expand...

I talked to Warner Electric today, who made the orginal actuator... They think my motor is going, that the torque is exceeding the motor's ability to lift the hatch... They also told me that they think that the parts are not available anymore to repair the orginal actuator. I was given a replacement part number of: K2 G10-12VM BR-18. This a 600lb vice 500lb lift actuator... I found it online for $319, it lists for $439. I am not sure how long my actuator will keep working, but is seems that our 2001 340s might be having similars problems... the part number for our actuators should be stamped in the base near the motor. Warner need the part number to determine if is repairable...
 
I took mine apart while I had it out of the boat and gave it a real good cleaning. The screw drive unit was pretty rusty, When I removed the 4 bolts holding the sleeve on, I unscrewed the ram by hand and it exposed the screw drive assembly and I greased the heck out of it with marine grease. I ran it up and down a few times and it made a huge difference. It is possible that it is binding up on you and with it having clutches in the little motor they could be engaging to early if the screw mechanism is tight. it works very much like a scissors jack. Mine works great now. I just have to figure out the wiring problem. I just spoke with Ken at Flounder Pounder and he is sending me out a new switch today. He is a great source of information and parts, not to mention just a real nice guy.

Thanks
Steve Bone
 
Sounds to me like you have a short in the wiring - you even mentioned a shock when you touched the actuator. I would look for wire chaffing where the wires enter the actuator.
 
Alex F said:
Rod,
Have you considered taking the actuator to the shop that fixes alternators and starters? Just an idea.
Click to expand...

That is a good idea Alex, as usual... I believe the jack screw needs to be greased too... It is woking now, but I am preparing for it to stop working soon... It has been that kind of year for me...
 
J R Sparky said:
We had the same problem with the hatch lift on our 2004 300 not working. Found the EIM was bad and there wasn't anything wrong with the actuator or the switch. Still waiting on the new EIM ($490) from SeaRay.
The hatch was a major pain to lift manually and don't want to have to do that again. Planning on installing a second switch with hard wires in the event of another EIM failure.
Hopefully your problem will be eliminated with a new switch.
Click to expand...

I went through the same scenario, spent the ~$500 on a new EIM and still had an intermittent issue. Turned out to be a couple of bad connector pins in a harness deep in the bowels of the starboard hull. A real PITA to troubleshoot.
 
Nansea, I am right there with you on the bad luck this season. Everything I have touched has turned to **** this year. Doesn't mean that I want the season to end. I just want the ****ty luck to end. It seems that everything I have done to my boat this season has taken twice as long to do it and twice as much money. I am spending the rest of the year on the low end of the throttles. No chances. Really it seems that my upgrade projects are going pretty well...it is the little maintenance things that are taking their toll on me and my wallet. Everything that I notice that may even be ok or good for another season or two are automatically taken care of and usually upgraded from what the factory did. Next week is the week of the Sub Woofer and yet another amplifier. yep your right I am the Village Idiot. Why can't I stop myself....:huh:

Steve
 
You said you got a shock when you touched the motor. Did you check your ground? A bad ground can be very frustrating to find. It can test good when not under load and go byby as soon as a load is applied.
 
Steve,

I think I win the idiot department.... Last year I hydrolocked my genny:smt021... I pickled it and and took in a part in the fall. Spent $2K in parts, rebuilt it and put it back in in May... could not get it to start :huh:(think I messed up the timing)... Ended paying $9K to have a new genny installed, this spring. I bought new statinless steel HI-TEK exhausts, another $5K intalled. Then my dripless seal went on my port engine went, $2.6K for new sure seals (port and starboard) and cutlass bearings... Not to mention, prop tune up, new mast light, windless breaker, railing damage, amp fuse, two raw water pumps, bottom painting, wax, zincs, and two short hauls... Now I am having trouble with the actuator... Will this ever end???? We are out of money, and there are still things I want to do...:smt089

Rod
 
I am not sure where the ground on it is. you only have two wires coming out of the actuator. They are red and yellow. If I hold a positive and negative wire from the battery to the red and yellow actuator wife she will go up and if I reverse them the actuator will go down. If i go positive from the battery and to a negative ground to the actuator motor I get nothing. I did check by grounding having a wire on the Actuator motor and holding it to the Negative on the Battery as well as running it from a riser bolt to the actuator motor. I got nothing from the switch. Something very strange though. When I ran my test light lead from the positive on the battery and touched it to a riser bolt on the port side engine it lit the tester bulb up like a Christmas tree. You would think that it would short and spark and no light up. I am left to think that the actuator motor switches 12 volts from the switch to red for up and yellow for down. The actuator must be self grounded when it is bolted in. man this is starting to sound stupid.

Thanks
steve
 
If you have any motor that is reversible and you only have 2 wires going to it, then it is self grounding. Check the grounding cable from the battery to the engine and also the dash/computer. The computer may not be getting a good ground at the dash.
 
Grounding that motor shell is a safety or bonding issue and has nothing to do with operation.

The motor has two wires. To go up you need +12 volts on one wire and you need the other wire to be at zero volts, or ground. This completes the circuit. Now to move the motor down you have to reverse the power.

Take your test light and connect it across the two wires. It should light when you press either up or down, a test light doesn't know up from down. If it doesn't light either your switch or EIM is dead.

To test the EIM, connect your test light from ground (riser bolt or battery minus) to one wire, it should light when you press either up or down not both. Test the other wire it should do the opposite. The next test is a little trickier. Connect your test light from battery plus to one wire, it should light when you press either up or down not both. Test the other wire it should do the opposite.
 
Wow Rod, that is some rough stuff for you. I would have a fit if i was having that much trouble. I have a 57 Chevy Pick up street rod that has made me nuts. I have around 100k in the truck and 220 miles on it. I had to remove the gauge brain yesterday and send it back. You name it...it has gone wrong. Driving me crazy. Everytime i fix something another major problem shows up. lucky for the truck that I love it or it would be a pile of ashes by now

Steve
 
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