Garmin Grid Remote - Helm seat mod

[Skybolt]

For my setup if you are offline and select engage route that is already established the boat will do an aggressive turn to get back to your route. I do also have the setting you mention “start in the boats position.”

I think the only way to truly get rid of the aggressive hard over is to Restart the route (maybe that’s what you meant) which will do so in your exact location.

I guess it could be, since any route I start, starts from the boat's position. If I put the pilot in standby I have to restart the route by hitting auto and it recalculates from the boat's position.

 

[Irie308]

In the settings on the GHC20, set the Rudder Gain to a lower number. The Rudder Gain is the speed/rate the rudder moves to acquire/maintain a course. The Rudder Countersteer is the setting to correct overshoot. Same here if the correction is too harsh - set to a lower setting.
Another thing I make sure to do is set the route start point well ahead of the vessel. If it is behind then the vessel will turn around to acquire and that can be spooky.

Thanks will give this a look. This is more so for when I steer to avoid something and want the autopilot to reengage.

 

[alnav]

I was doing some autopilot research for the software update thread that was active today. I found there is an "Acceleration Limiter" setting that will speed up or slow down autopilot turns. I haven't used it but it seems to me it might be part of the solution for aggressive returns to routes. It's located under Autopilot Tuning, same place as Rudder Gain. I'm thinking rudder gain might not help much for turning behavior back to a route and might only result in crappy performance during regular autopilot operation.

 

[alnav]

Using the "Nav bar" helps me avoid drastic turns returning to routes. When a route is turned on, there is a magenta line showing the route course in relation to current heading. If there is a big difference in the two, a big turn is guaranteed if Follow Route is invoked. So, I will first steer the boat manually to line up with the magenta heading, then engage the AP. Here's what it looks like:

I keep the nav bar on one of my screens full time whether I'm using the AP or not. I will sometimes have a route turned on but not use the AP; the magenta line is a good cue for me that keeps me close to or on the route.

 

[Irie308]

Will look into the acceleration limiter. My issue is with shadow drive. When you touch the wheel the message that pops up to cancel or reengage your route tends to cover the vessel icon and lower 3rd of the screen so I can’t see how far I am off course to navigate back to the route. When I hit engage the aggressive turn is dependent on how far off course I am. If that doesn’t work I guess I could always move that navigation bar to the top off the display rather than the bottom.

 

[alnav]

Will look into the acceleration limiter. My issue is with shadow drive. When you touch the wheel the message that pops up to cancel or reengage your route tends to cover the vessel icon and lower 3rd of the screen so I can’t see how far I am off course to navigate back to the route. When I hit engage the aggressive turn is dependent on how far off course I am. If that doesn’t work I guess I could always move that navigation bar to the top off the display rather than the bottom.

I agree the pop-up is annoying. You ought to see what the latest (7 July) software update offers. According to the documentation, it moves pop-ups to the upper right-hand corner and makes them smaller. I'm not entirely sure it does that for the shadow drive pop-up but it is worth a look. Here's an example from the update flyer:

 

[b_arrington]

Will look into the acceleration limiter. My issue is with shadow drive. When you touch the wheel the message that pops up to cancel or reengage your route tends to cover the vessel icon and lower 3rd of the screen so I can’t see how far I am off course to navigate back to the route. When I hit engage the aggressive turn is dependent on how far off course I am. If that doesn’t work I guess I could always move that navigation bar to the top off the display rather than the bottom.

This is interesting. I don't get a pop-up message about reengaging the route when I turn the wheel. Maybe it's because I don't control the AP through the main screen, but use the GHC 20 control display?

Two things Rusty taught me about using the autopilot.

• First, instead of reengaging the route use the "restart route" function. I think this was mentioned before. The difference is that Reengage Route will swing the boat back to the magenta line to follow it precisely, possibly with aggressive turns as noted. "Restart Route" will set the boat to the next waypoint on the route from your current location. This usually results in a smooth resumption in AP behavior, especially if you're already pointed in the correct general direction.
• Second, use "heading hold" most of the time. The boat is generally going in a straight line. You can easily nudge the course or change it at the next waypoint by tapping the course change arrows.

A third thing I've found that helps with AP route following is the how tightly you force the AP to follow the route. If you set it to like 50 feet you're in for a rough ride with lots of course corrections because of the tight tolerance. If you set it for like 500-1000 feet your path will be smoother with fewer corrections. Obviously this wide tolerance is not ideal for a tight area with a lot of turns, but I'd argue the AP shouldn't be on then anyway.

Also related, create your waypoints and routes offset from known navigation markers. If, for example, you set your waypoint right atop a safe water mark you risk a) striking the marker and b) getting close to another boater that's done the same.

 

[b_arrington]

I agree the pop-up is annoying. You ought to see what the latest (7 July) software update offers. According to the documentation, it moves pop-ups to the upper right-hand corner and makes them smaller. I'm not entirely sure it does that for the shadow drive pop-up but it is worth a look. Here's an example from the update flyer:
View attachment 147377

That message change looks like it might be better.

 

[ttmott]

I agree the pop-up is annoying. You ought to see what the latest (7 July) software update offers. According to the documentation, it moves pop-ups to the upper right-hand corner and makes them smaller. I'm not entirely sure it does that for the shadow drive pop-up but it is worth a look. Here's an example from the update flyer:
View attachment 147377

AIS alerts/alarms do the same large banner across the bottom. It is a problem around marina's as many boats leave their AIS transmitting. I usually have to turn it off to keep those banners in check.

This is interesting. I don't get a pop-up message about reengaging the route when I turn the wheel. Maybe it's because I don't control the AP through the main screen, but use the GHC 20 control display?

Two things Rusty taught me about using the autopilot.

• First, instead of reengaging the route use the "restart route" function. I think this was mentioned before. The difference is that Reengage Route will swing the boat back to the magenta line to follow it precisely, possibly with aggressive turns as noted. "Restart Route" will set the boat to the next waypoint on the route from your current location. This usually results in a smooth resumption in AP behavior, especially if you're already pointed in the correct general direction.
• Second, use "heading hold" most of the time. The boat is generally going in a straight line. You can easily nudge the course or change it at the next waypoint by tapping the course change arrows.

A third thing I've found that helps with AP route following is the how tightly you force the AP to follow the route. If you set it to like 50 feet you're in for a rough ride with lots of course corrections because of the tight tolerance. If you set it for like 500-1000 feet your path will be smoother with fewer corrections. Obviously this wide tolerance is not ideal for a tight area with a lot of turns, but I'd argue the AP shouldn't be on then anyway.

Also related, create your waypoints and routes offset from known navigation markers. If, for example, you set your waypoint right atop a safe water mark you risk a) striking the marker and b) getting close to another boater that's done the same.

If I pause a route through steering input or pressing to standby and then re-engage no matter the method the boat will turn as abruptly as it can to reacquire. Again, dampening the turn is through the Rudder Gain adjustment really helps. I don't seem to remember a large banner across the bottom when the shadow drive terminates the route. However, it is important to be notified that the interruption has occurred. One might get out of the seat and bump the wheel and dis-engage and not realize it.
The downside to the Garmin Nav suite is the complexity to terminate and reacquire routing in my opinion on having and using the equipment for the last 4 years.

 

[b_arrington]

AIS alerts/alarms do the same large banner across the bottom. It is a problem around marina's as many boats leave their AIS transmitting. I usually have to turn it off to keep those banners in check.

If I pause a route through steering input or pressing to standby and then re-engage no matter the method the boat will turn as abruptly as it can to reacquire. Again, dampening the turn is through the Rudder Gain adjustment really helps. I don't seem to remember a large banner across the bottom when the shadow drive terminates the route. However, it is important to be notified that the interruption has occurred. One might get out of the seat and bump the wheel and dis-engage and not realize it.
The downside to the Garmin Nav suite is the complexity to terminate and reacquire routing in my opinion on having and using the equipment for the last 4 years.

I'm going to have to look at the menu sequence next time I'm at the boat. The way Rusty showed me, the "restart route" recalculates the path to the next waypoint from your current position. I used it a bunch of times on our trip up from Charleston. It will not take you back to the original path and cause crazy abrupt turns.

I do agree a proper rudder gain setting is very important for comfortable and safe performance.

After thinking about it more, if the AP becomes disengaged I do get a message along the lines of "AP disengaged. Reengage? Yes/No I don't recall the exact trigger though.

 

[ttmott]

I'm going to have to look at the menu sequence next time I'm at the boat. The way Rusty showed me, the "restart route" recalculates the path to the next waypoint from your current position. I used it a bunch of times on our trip up from Charleston. It will not take you back to the original path and cause crazy abrupt turns.

I do agree a proper rudder gain setting is very important for comfortable and safe performance.

After thinking about it more, if the AP becomes disengaged I do get a message along the lines of "AP disengaged. Reengage? Yes/No I don't recall the exact trigger though.

I think you are right but if you do an AutoRoute or customized route and have inputted direction changes to avoid obstacles or depth issues then a Restart Route feature could present hazards that the AutoRoute avoided. Just a caution.

 

[alnav]

I'm going to have to look at the menu sequence next time I'm at the boat. The way Rusty showed me, the "restart route" recalculates the path to the next waypoint from your current position. I used it a bunch of times on our trip up from Charleston. It will not take you back to the original path and cause crazy abrupt turns.

I do agree a proper rudder gain setting is very important for comfortable and safe performance.

After thinking about it more, if the AP becomes disengaged I do get a message along the lines of "AP disengaged. Reengage? Yes/No I don't recall the exact trigger though.

Here's the message Irie and I are talking about. I believe it's only triggered by a shadow drive diversion from a route, but not sure of that. Hoping the latest update shrinks the alert and moves it to the corner. The example I posted earlier already fixes the Marpa (which I use a lot) alarm so already pleased with that.

 

[Skybolt]

I'm going to have to look at the menu sequence next time I'm at the boat. The way Rusty showed me, the "restart route" recalculates the path to the next waypoint from your current position. I used it a bunch of times on our trip up from Charleston. It will not take you back to the original path and cause crazy abrupt turns. ...

You are correct, I use this feature all of the time. No crazy Ivan's that way. I have an extra step using RM, but still "Restart Route" is on the MFD.

 

[Skybolt]

... Hoping the latest update shrinks the alert and moves it to the corner. ...

Al, the 76xx series isn't getting any more updates, it's stuck at 20.40/4.40. I have that as well, but is stuck at 20.40. Only the newer MFD's are getting the changes to 32.10.

https://www8.garmin.com/support/note.jsp?id=8743

GPSMAP 8612/8612xsv: 32.10
GPSMAP 1223/1243/1253: 32.10
GPSMAP 7608/7608xsv: 20.40/4.40

 

[alnav]

Al, the 76xx series isn't getting any more updates, it's stuck at 20.40/4.40. I have that as well, but is stuck at 20.40. Only the newer MFD's are getting the changes to 32.10.

https://www8.garmin.com/support/note.jsp?id=8743

GPSMAP 8612/8612xsv: 32.10
GPSMAP 1223/1243/1253: 32.10
GPSMAP 7608/7608xsv: 20.40/4.40

I know. My main MFDs are 8612s but I still have the 7608 sitting atop the console. I've been hoping Garmin will release a new series to give me an excuse to replace it with a newer unit that will update.
I took the picture of the 7608 the other day when I was comparing the difference between the new AP screen on the 8612s with the old still showing on the 7608.

 

[rlynch03]

Will look into the acceleration limiter. My issue is with shadow drive. When you touch the wheel the message that pops up to cancel or reengage your route tends to cover the vessel icon and lower 3rd of the screen so I can’t see how far I am off course to navigate back to the route. When I hit engage the aggressive turn is dependent on how far off course I am. If that doesn’t work I guess I could always move that navigation bar to the top off the display rather than the bottom.

The latest updates move the

This is interesting. I don't get a pop-up message about reengaging the route when I turn the wheel. Maybe it's because I don't control the AP through the main screen, but use the GHC 20 control display?

Two things Rusty taught me about using the autopilot.

• First, instead of reengaging the route use the "restart route" function. I think this was mentioned before. The difference is that Reengage Route will swing the boat back to the magenta line to follow it precisely, possibly with aggressive turns as noted. "Restart Route" will set the boat to the next waypoint on the route from your current location. This usually results in a smooth resumption in AP behavior, especially if you're already pointed in the correct general direction.
• Second, use "heading hold" most of the time. The boat is generally going in a straight line. You can easily nudge the course or change it at the next waypoint by tapping the course change arrows.

A third thing I've found that helps with AP route following is the how tightly you force the AP to follow the route. If you set it to like 50 feet you're in for a rough ride with lots of course corrections because of the tight tolerance. If you set it for like 500-1000 feet your path will be smoother with fewer corrections. Obviously this wide tolerance is not ideal for a tight area with a lot of turns, but I'd argue the AP shouldn't be on then anyway.

Also related, create your waypoints and routes offset from known navigation markers. If, for example, you set your waypoint right atop a safe water mark you risk a) striking the marker and b) getting close to another boater that's done the same.

I agree with all of this and use most of them... Great email of tips.

 

[rlynch03]

Here's the message Irie and I are talking about. I believe it's only triggered by a shadow drive diversion from a route, but not sure of that. Hoping the latest update shrinks the alert and moves it to the corner. The example I posted earlier already fixes the Marpa (which I use a lot) alarm so already pleased with that.
View attachment 147378

Yes they have moved this to the top right corner (in the latest update) which is better but still irritating. The unit will continue to ask this question until you select Cancel or Engage.

 

[Skybolt]

I know. My main MFDs are 8612s but I still have the 7608 sitting atop the console. I've been hoping Garmin will release a new series to give me an excuse to replace it with a newer unit that will update.
I took the picture of the 7608 the other day when I was comparing the difference between the new AP screen on the 8612s with the old still showing on the 7608.

Got it. The 943xsv is very close in size and only slightly larger if you can fit it in. The x43 series has all of the same functionality as the 86xx series.

 

[alnav]

Got it. The 943xsv is very close in size and only slightly larger if you can fit it in. The x43 series has all of the same functionality as the 86xx series.

I've thought about the 943 but it only has one network port and I am tapped out. I would have to get a second network extender to make it work; not sure where I would put that.

 

[Skybolt]

I've thought about the 943 but it only has one network port and I am tapped out. I would have to get a second network extender to make it work; not sure where I would put that.

Are your 86's going to the GMS10 independently or are they daisy chained together? Only one needs to go to the GMS10. Or plug the 7808 into one of the 2nd ports on the 86's. Although that's not optimal unless all display's are turned on at the same time.