The Official 450 Express Bridge Owners Club

Forrestkk said:
Rudder Packing

Has anyone repacked their rudders?

My starboard rudder leaks when it is cold. Wondering if I should just have it done by the yard.
Click to expand...
Yes twice in 14 years, but have you tried just tightening it up...?
 
Shoyrtt said:
They said last Friday that it would be "about a week." They called yesterday and said it was done and I was shocked. I live an hour and half (with traffic) away from the yard and my work week schedule is pretty tight. There was no chance that I could have been there today. I ran though the list of items and they had missed the boot stripe. I was hoping that would push it out to this Friday, but their sub contractor had it done by 10 this morning!

I wonder if anyone else will share what you paid for bottom paint on your boat? I picked this shipyard based on several recommendations from friends at my yacht club. Parts on the paint etc came up to $1,379 and labor was $1,449. With California sales tax on the parts, my total was $2,970 and change. I could have saved a few bucks if I took it to Ensenada, but I didn't want to deal with that long of a trip this time of year.
Click to expand...

I do my own, $500 for Amercoat 214 PPG, 5 gallons, travel lift, yard time, vacuum sander, approx $1,000 and a bottle of Advil..
 
The Bill Collector said:
Yes, and pipe wrench & the giant type crescent wrench ( not sure of the proper name)
Click to expand...
Called packing wrenches.
I also completely unthread the packing nut and run that jamb nun down as far as possible, wire brush the threads, and treat the rudder shaft to a little polishing with emery cloth. Then, spray the threads with Boeshield T10 and put it all back together. You can feel that packing compress so much better. The adjustable wrenches never worked for me; these are like what I got -
R.ecc23b2ffa11b15f226c6306b298ec65
 
ttmott said:
Called packing wrenches.
I also completely unthread the packing nut and run that jamb nun down as far as possible, wire brush the threads, and treat the rudder shaft to a little polishing with emery cloth. Then, spray the threads with Boeshield T10 and put it all back together. You can feel that packing compress so much better. The adjustable wrenches never worked for me; these are like what I got -
R.ecc23b2ffa11b15f226c6306b298ec65
Click to expand...

Thx @ttmott. Those make sense based on the space I'll have to work in.
 
Forrestkk said:
With the exception of the aqua hull, would be proud to get my boat to this level one day.

https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/2001-sea-ray-450-express-bridge-8205739/?curr=USD&utm_source=search alerts&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=YW_SearchAlerts&utm_content=2132022
Click to expand...
The owner must be meticulous. I'm posting the description of the boat in the Yacht World ad (in multiple posts) for future reference (when the boat is sold, the ad of course is gone). If you ever decide to sell your 450 EB, this is an incredible template to work from:

2021/2022 Upgrades
  • Complete Fly Bridge enclosure
  • Salon and Cockpit Aqua Weave Teak Decking
  • Cockpit Palm Shade
  • Hurley H3O+ Davit Electric Boat Tender Davi
  • Magma “Monterey” + Swim Platform Pedestal Mount + Fiberglass Tank
  • LED Lighting
  • Awlgrip Custom Hull Painted
  • Complete Bottom Job – Scraped, Sand, 2 coats
  • New 10kw Diesel Generator
  • All New batteries – 9/2021
  • Bow Thruster – Magana Power 1420 CA
  • Delco House Battery – 1000 CA
  • Delco Starter Battery – 1000CA
  • Gen. Battery – 620 CA
  • New Engine Raw Water Pump
  • ALL A/C’s serviced
  • All Engines serviced
  • New Zincs and Bottom Scrubbed
Hull & Deck Features
  • Bottom Paint
  • Bow Pulpit, Integral
  • Bow Rail, 316 Stainless Steel w/Welded Stanchions
  • Cleats, Custom Sea Ray® Thru-Bolted - Stainless Steel (8)
  • Color Schemes (Blue, Green, Black/Gold)
  • Deck Fill Plates, Stainless Steel
  • Deck Rails, 316 Stainless Steel
  • Foam-Filled Under Floor Areas
  • Awlgrip Hull, Sky Blue
  • Graphics, Striping
  • Handrails, 316 Stainless Steel
  • Hatch, Deck Vent - Translucent w/Locks & Sky Screen Cover (20x20)
  • Light, Stern
  • Lights, Navigation
  • Portlights, Stainless Steel (4 Fixed, 6 Opening)
  • Resin, High-Performance Vinylester
  • Rub Rail, PVC with Stainless Steel Insert
  • Storage, Transom Wall - Fenders & Gear
  • Stringer System, Fiberglass Hatman
  • Swim Platform, Extended with Concealed Stainless Steel
  • Three-Step Swim Ladder with Integral Grab Handle
  • Thru-Hull Fittings, Color-Coordinated
  • Toe Rail, Molded Fiberglass - Deck
  • Vent System, Engine Room - Integral
  • Windows, Deck Side with Sliding Vent Windows & Screens
  • Windshield, Tempered/Tinted Curved Glass
  • Windshield, Bridge Venturi (Aluminum)
 
Bridge Features
  • Beverage Holders (5)
  • Carpet Liner, Snap-In
  • Control Station with Windscreen (Located in Center Bridge)
  • Handrails, 316 Stainless Steel
  • Refrigerator, 120V
  • LED Lighting, Indirect – New 2022
  • Outlet, 12V Accessory
  • Outlet, 120V GFI Protected
  • Seating, Aft Bench
  • Seating, Forward/Aft Bench with Storage Below
  • Seating, Helm - Custom Euro-Style with Flip-Up Thigh-Rise Bolster, Armrest & Heavy-Duty Pedestal with Slide, Swivel & Pneumatic Vertical Adjustment
  • Ship’s Bell
  • Sport Spoiler, Molded Fiberglass (Seamless) with Overhead High Output LED Flood Lighting
  • Steps, Molded Bridge Access with Storage Below
  • Stereo (Fusion Marine ®), 12V AM/FM/iPhone/ Sirius XM Single BLUE TOOTH, Amplifier, Subwoofer, Speakers (6) & Cockpit/Bridge Remote Control Two (2) remote controllers (Fusion Marine ®)
  • Table, Bridge
  • Walk-Thru Bridge with Door & Hinged Venturi
  • Wet Bar with Sink, Faucet, Stainless Steel Handrail, Trash Receptacle & Storage Cabinet Below
  • Rod Holders (4)
Cockpit Features
  • Teak Aqua Weave Decking, Snap-In
  • Door, Cabin Entry (Sliding & Lockable) with Screen
  • Doors, Transom (2) - Port & Starboard
  • Floor Liner, Fiberglass - Self-Bailing
  • Hatch, Service (Engine Room) - Gas-Assisted
  • LED Lighting, Indirect
  • Rod Holders (2)
  • Teak Seating, Aft Bench - Fold-Out
  • Teak Starboard Table 18” x 24”
  • Teak Center Table 48” x 30”
  • Steps, Molded Deck Access
  • Storage, Aft Coaming with Fiberglass Bins
  • Storage, Side Panels
  • Full Cock Pit Palm Shade
Swim Platform
  • Fiber Glass Fully Supported to 1000# 14’ Length x 3’ depth
  • Additional Added Hurley H3O+ Electric Remote Control Davit System -New 2022
  • Swim Platform removable mounted Maga BBQ Stanchion
Cabin Features
  • Carbon Monoxide Monitors
  • Deep-Pile BCF - 44-Ounce
  • Carpet Runners, Interior (Sunbrella®)
  • Lighting, 12V LED
  • Lighting, 12V Indirect LED
  • Lighting, 120V LED
  • Outlets, Phone
  • Pillows, Accent
  • Polished Brass Outlet & Switch Plates
  • Shades, Fabric Day/Night w/Drape Trim
  • Storage, In-Floor
  • Vacuum System, Central - Dual Inlet (BeamTM)
  • Wood Trim, Handcrafted
 
Salon & Dinette
  • Aqua Weave Teak Carpet + Deep-Pile BCF - 44-Ounce
  • Entertainment System - Stereo, 12V Double Din AM/FM Digital Cassette & Single CD Player w/6-Disc CD Changer, Amplifier & Speakers (8) TV, 36" with Remote & Outlet for Antenna & TV Coax to Dockside
  • Filler Cushions
  • Seating, U-Shaped Sofa - Converts to Bed (Ultraleather HPTM)
  • Storage, Cabinets
  • Table, Dinette (Folding Leaf) with Corian® Surface & Dedicated Storage
Windlass System
  • Anchor Chute, Stainless Steel
  • Anchor Rope/Chain Storage with Hatch
  • Anchor Washdown Spigot with Hose
  • Anchor, Galvanized
  • Windlass, Rope/Chain with Foot Switches & Remote Helm Control Switches (Lofrans Progress I)
Master Forward Stateroom
  • Bed, Full-Size w/Innerspring Mattress, Pillows, Plus 2” Foam Top Spread with Drawer Storage Below
  • Door, Privacy
  • Hanging Locker, Cedar-Lined with Light & Mirrored Door - Port
  • Hanging Locker with Shelves, Light & Mirrored Door - Starboard
  • Mirrored Rope Locker Bulkhead
  • Storage, Gunwale Cabinets
  • Storage, Side Shelves
  • TV/20" with Remote & Outlet for Antenna & TV coax to dockside
  • Master Stateroom Head
  • Clothes Hook
  • Door, Privacy - Access from Forward Stateroom
  • Handrails, Elliptical Stainless Steel
  • Head with Fiberglass Settee Lid (VacuFlush®)
  • Power Vent, 12V
  • Shower with Seat, Adjustable Shower Wand & Circular Acrylic Door
  • Storage Cabinet, Upper
  • Storage, Medicine Cabinet - Mirrored
  • Vanity with Corian® Countertop, Sink, Grohe® Faucet & storage below
VIP Second Stateroom
  • Bed, Full-Size with Innerspring Mattress, Pillows, Plus 2” Foam Top
  • Spread with Carpeted Storage Below
  • Door, Privacy
  • Hanging Locker, Cedar-Lined with Light & Mirrored Door
  • Skylight, Circular
  • Storage, Cabinet & Drawers
  • TV Coax to Dockside
Guest Head
  • Clothes Hook
  • Door, Privacy - Access from Guest Stateroom
  • Door, Privacy - Access from Salon
  • Handrails, Elliptical Stainless Steel
  • Head with Fiberglass Settee Lid (VacuFlush®)
  • Power Vent, 12V
  • Shower with Seat, Adjustable Shower Wand & Circular Acrylic Door
  • Storage, Medicine Cabinet - Mirrored
  • Vanity with Corian® Countertop, Sink, Grohe® Faucet & storage below
Third Stateroom - Aft
  • Bed, Full-Size w/Pillows, Sheets
  • Storage, Cabinet - Upper
  • Snap-on 6 Drawer Tool Box, with 120V, LED lighting
Galley
  • Breakfast Bar with Swivel Bar Stool
  • Countertop, Molded Fiberglass with Granite-Colored
  • Gel-Coat, Sink, Single-Lever Grohe® Faucet & Corian® Sink Cover
  • LED Lighting, Dual-Voltage - 120V/12V
  • Microwave/Convection Oven, 120V
  • Power Vent, 12V
  • Refrigerator/Freezer, Upright - Dual-Voltage - 120V/12V
  • Storage Cabinet - Dish
  • Storage, Drawers with Cutlery Insert
  • Storage, Upper & Lower with Designated Plate, Glass &Bottle Storage
  • Stove, 240V Flush-Mount Three-Burner with Stainless Steel Safety Rail
  • Trash Receptacle with Chute & Corian® Cover
Helm Station
  • Alarms, Engine - Oil, Water & Transmission Oil
  • Alarms, High-Water - Bilge & Cabin
  • Compass Riche W50 – New 2022
  • Emergency Start System - Engines
  • Horns, Air (Concealed) - Dual Trumpet
  • Instrumentation, Custom Sea Ray®
  • Backlit with Low-Glare Blue LED Night Lighting &Stainless Steel Bezels
  • Fuel (2)
  • Oil Pressure (2)
  • Tachometers with LCD Hourmeters (2)
  • Voltmeters (2)
  • Water Temperature (2)
  • Panel, Instrument - High-Gloss Burl
  • Panel, Switch - Backlit Burl Lexan
  • Shift & Throttle Controls with Gold Knobs
  • Spotlight with Dual Halogen Bulbs - Remote-Controlled (ACR®)
  • Steering, Hydraulic
  • Steering, Tilt Wheel
  • Steering Wheel, Wood-Accent
  • Switches, Illuminated Weatherproof Rockers & Dimmer Control
  • Systems Monitor, Digital LCD - for Engine Diagnostics & pump monitoring Electronics
  • GPS (Raytheon RayNav 300 GPS) with WAAS Differential Sensor
  • Multifunction Instrument (Raytheon Tridata ST-60)
  • Depth Finder
  • Speed/Sumlog
  • Water Temperature
  • VHF Radio (iCOM) w/Remote Speaker & Bridge Wing mounted Hailer / Listen
  • 8' Fiberglass Antenna
  • Raymarine E-80
  • Raymarine E-125
  • ST7000+ Auto Pilot
  • Fuel Flow Scan
  • Digital Color Raymarine RADAR 48nm
Electrical System
  • Batteries, 8-D with Boxes (2) & Group 27 for Genset (1) All New 2021
  • Battery Charger/Converter, 120V/50 Amp/12V
  • Electronics Circuit with Ground Plate, 50 Amp/12V
  • Inlet, TV Coax & Telephone with Cords
  • Isolator, Galvanic
  • Panel, DC Main Breaker
  • Panel, Main Distribution - AC
  • Panel, Main Distribution - DC
  • Panel, Remote Circuit Breaker
  • Shore Power, Cablemaster (Glendinning)
  • 50 Amp/240V/60 Cycle with 75' Cord
  • Wiring, Color-Coded w/Chafe Protection
  • Remote Start with Muffler, Freshwater Cooling, Fuel Filter, Seacock & Seawater Strainer, 240V
  • 10 kW NextGen Diesel Generator – New 2022
Air Conditioning / Heat
  • Zone-Controlled Reverse-Cycle System
  • Salon (30,000 BTU)
  • Captain Cabin (7,500 BTU)
  • Guest & Aft Cabin (7,500 BTU)
  • Custom Integral Vent System
Engine Room
  • Bilge Pumps, 12V Automatic (2)
  • Bilge Pumps, 12V Automatic High-Water (1 Bilge, 1 Cabin)
  • Blowers, 12V Bilge (2)
  • Engine Drip Sumps
  • Exhaust, Underwater - Patented
  • Fire Suppression System - Automatic
  • Freshwater Cooling
  • Gel-Coated Engine Room, Gray
  • Insulation, 2" with Loaded Vinyl Barrier
  • Ladder, Stainless Steel - Removable
  • LED Lighting, 12V
  • LED Lighting 120V
  • Oil Changer System - Engines, Transmissions
  • Synchronizer, Engine
Fuel System
  • Bilge Pumps, 12V Automatic (2)
  • Bilge Pumps, 12V Automatic High-Water (1 Bilge, 1 Cabin)
  • Blowers, 12V Bilge (2)
  • Engine Drip Sumps
  • Exhaust, Underwater - Patented
  • Fire Suppression System - Automatic
  • Freshwater Cooling
  • Gel-Coated Engine Room, Gray
  • Insulation, 2" with Loaded Vinyl Barrier
  • Ladder, Stainless Steel - Removable
  • LED Lighting, 12V
  • LED Lighting 120V
  • Oil Changer System - Engines, Transmissions
  • Synchronizer, Engine
Waste System
  • Central Drain System
  • Head System (VacuFlush®)
  • Holding Tank Level Indicators - MDP & Heads
  • Holding Tank with Dockside Pump-Out (60-Gallon)
  • Sump Box w/Pumps, Automatic
  • Holding Tank Air Vent Filters – New 2022
Water System
  • Freshwater Washdown Hose Spigot
  • Engine Room Freshwater Washdown Spigot - Transom
  • Pressure Water System with Dual 12V Pumps
  • Shower, Cockpit - Hot & Cold
  • Water Heater, 240V (8.5-Gallon)
  • Water Inlet, Dockside
  • Water Tank (100-Gallon)
Underwater Gear
  • Bonding System with Zinc Hull Plate
  • Propeller Shafts, 1 3/4" Stainless Steel (2) - Aquamet 22
  • Propellers, Nibral 4-Blade Cup
  • EXTRA Set of Propellers, Nibral 4-Blade Cup
  • Rudders - Manganese-Bronze with Stainless Steel Posts
  • Seacocks on all Underwater Fittings
  • Seawater Strainers
  • Shaft Logs, Dripless with Extra Seal Carrier Kit
  • Struts - Manganese-Bronze
  • Trim Tabs, Hydraulic
  • Bow Thruster “Ventus”
  • Stern Thruster
  • Lumitec “Sea BlazeX” Underwater Multi Color LED Lights
 
Got out to deep water yesterday to get numbers for getting my props tuned. We have to get into the Gulf (10 miles from our dock) to get anything deeper than 30 feet. Our prop shop is adamant about getting into water that is deeper than the length of the boat, and even a bit deeper if possible. This makes sense as the prop shop says "the water cannot get out of the way" fast enough to get a true reading. When I flew in the USAF, helicopters were the same way, one rotor diameter before "ground effect" no longer increase lift for the rotor system (just a different propeller). In this case, shallow water increase resistance on the hull causing lower speed reading as compared to the RPM.

Before we headed out, I photo-tach'd the engines and found some interesting info. At idle, the tachs are close, but as the RPMs increased, they became more accurate. According to the previous owner the port tach read 50 RPM low. Yesterday, I found the opposite. The port actually reads 25 RPM faster than actual and the starboard is 25 RPM slower than actual. A 50 RPM split (if you can actually discern 25 RPM on our tachs).

To get the readings, I started out with a crosswind and then kept the rudder centered. I let the wind blow us off course so I wasn't creating drag with the rudders and did this in opposite directions and averaged speeds to get as close to a no-wind reading as possible.

Here are the numbers
Idle - 625 RPM - 5.5 kts
Cruise 2000 RPM -15.5 kts (max 15.8)
WOT - 2425 RPM - 23.3 kts (max 24.4)

Obviously, I am over-propped. My hope is that when the props are adjusted that I'll get 2650 to 2700 at WOT and that will that will likely require a reduction of pitch or cup, gaining the additional RPMs should offset some of that loss. Even if I lose a bit, it will be MUCH better for the longevity if the engines.

Because we were in the Gulf, why not stop for dinner in Destin on the way home.

20220219_164110.jpg
 
Last edited:
New helm faucet, just broke after 22 years. About $60 total to fix. Had to replace the Pex T and drain fitting.

Before
20220208_173106.jpg


After
20220220_104946.jpg
 
Last edited:
Forrestkk said:
New helm faucet, just broke after 22 years. About $60total to fix. Had to replace the Pex T and drain fitting.

Before
View attachment 120957

AfterView attachment 120958
Click to expand...
Kevin, what did you use for the drain fitting? My old faucet is still ok, but I had a leak in the drain fitting and I couldn’t find the part. I cobbled it back together and fixed the leak, but it’s ugly.
26DE297D-8B6E-4388-AA66-460B608532A4.jpeg
 
Shoyrtt said:
Kevin, what did you use for the drain fitting? My old faucet is still ok, but I had a leak in the drain fitting and I couldn’t find the part. I cobbled it back together and fixed the leak, but it’s ugly.
View attachment 120964
Click to expand...

Bought it on Amazon, whole new fitting. Had to use an adapter to get it to fit the drain hose. West Marine has them too.

Realized this had been leaking for awhile, but previous owner didn't realize and kept using the sink...made a big mess.

Replacement Boat Parts Elbow... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FZHBKDO?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share
 
Forrestkk said:
Looks great. Did you buy the stripe and just have the yard install?
Click to expand...
No, my friend Doug who is slipped across from me recommended a guy who just does boot stripes for most of the yards here in SoCal. I called the yard and told them to use Jim Kuhn. $600 I thought was reasonable and it looks a lot better than the tattered gold stripe that was there before.
 
Last edited:
Forrestkk said:
Got out to deep water yesterday to get numbers for getting my props tuned. We have to get into the Gulf (10 miles from our dock) to get anything deeper than 30 feet. Our prop shop is adamant about getting into water that is deeper than the length of the boat, and even a bit deeper if possible. This makes sense as the prop shop says "the water cannot get out of the way" fast enough to get a true reading. When I flew in the USAF, helicopters were the same way, one rotor diameter before "ground effect" no longer increase lift for the rotor system (just a different propeller). In this case, shallow water increase resistance on the hull causing lower speed reading as compared to the RPM.

Before we headed out, I photo-tach'd the engines and found some interesting info. At idle, the tachs are close, but as the RPMs increased, they became more accurate. According to the previous owner the port tach read 50 RPM low. Yesterday, I found the opposite. The port actually reads 25 RPM faster than actual and the starboard is 25 RPM slower than actual. A 50 RPM split (if you can actually discern 25 RPM on our tachs).

To get the readings, I started out with a crosswind and then kept the rudder centered. I let the wind blow us off course so I wasn't creating drag with the rudders and did this in opposite directions and averaged speeds to get as close to a no-wind reading as possible.

Here are the numbers
Idle - 625 RPM - 5.5 kts
Cruise 2000 RPM -15.5 kts (max 15.8)
WOT - 2425 RPM - 23.3 kts (max 24.4)

Obviously, I am over-propped. My hope is that when the props are adjusted that I'll get 2650 to 2700 at WOT and that will that will likely require a reduction of pitch or cup, gaining the additional RPMs should offset some of that loss. Even if I lose a bit, it will be MUCH better for the longevity if the engines.

Because we were in the Gulf, why not stop for dinner in Destin on the way home.

View attachment 120951
Click to expand...
I am getting very similar numbers with my props. I am currently getting mine repitched at a propeller shop in Lake Ozark, MO that had some great recommendations from others in my area -- Cool Breeze Marine. When I dropped off my props, George spent about an hour asking questions and making calculations. He also showed me the high-tech machine he uses. Quite impressive. He is going to repitch from 27" (previous owner had +1" over factory setting) to 22" with a target WOT RPM of 2700-2750. I'll let you know how things work out later this spring when I swap them out.
 
Forrestkk said:
I definitely do digester in both heads to get it in both tanks (but only once per tank of shit) for the reason you point out. I also believe in letting the tanks get at least to half before I pump. This came from my time at my dad's RV biz.

If black water tanks don't have enough liquid to slosh a bit and let waste decompose they get sludge from paper and shit. With the carbon filters we have on the vent lines, you can let the slosh work for you a little bit without the worry of deck odor. My $0.02.
Click to expand...
I learned a trick from our previous owner. We have a mobile pump-out service at our marina, so I normally leave both T-valves open. When I pump out at the marina when fueling up, I close off the starboard holding tank, empty and rinse the port tank, close it off, open the starboard tank, empty and rinse, then open them both up again. In theory, this should focus the suction and rinsing on one tank at a time.
 
Last edited:
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