Wiring a Shore Power Inlet in the Anchor Box

[Dustin.In.DC]

My Kohler genny is toast and there are no options available currently with Westerbeke backordered 4 months and I don't really want to spend 13k on a generator.

I am pretty a handy do it your selfer and I would like to run a shore power connection to the anchor box and have a portable genny located on the bow with the exhaust directed forward to have it completely out of the way and mitigate any CO issues. I want to prevent having a cord running down the side of the boat from my transom locker, that's the goal here.

It could be as simple as running an entire cord through the hull from the transom locker to the anchor locker but the end connectors would require some large openings to get it through there.

Do I really need to install an inlet in the anchor box or could I remove the female end of a cord and use a switch panel of some sort to splice in where the original shore power connects? This would leave the male end of the shore power cord in the anchor box thus eliminating the need for an inlet in theory.

How would you guys go about accomplishing having a genny located on the bow without having a cord running from the transom outside your vessel up to the bow?

 

[Dustin.In.DC]

I'm thinking remove either end of the cord, run the cut end through the boat then reattach the connector. Seems the easiest and safest way way to accomplish this and requires no alterations to the 110 system. Now what is going to be the easiest way to run it?

 

[pyro]

What's wrong with the Kohler? I think most things can be fixed, except the engine block since I heard they don't make those engines anymore and parts are hard to come by.

 

[Fill Ess]

They do sell just the connectors/ends to shore power cords if you wanted to cut one end and run the wire. Can you explain this further? Is this for day use or overnights? Would you even be able to sleep in the fwd berth with a genny running overhead? Where would you keep/store it when underway? Strapped to the bow when in use or all the time?

I see you are new to the site (welcome!) but there's been a ton of debate here in the past over whether or not to use a portable genny at all, and usually it's people asking about running one in the cockpit or on the swim platform. I don't think I've seen anyone ask about putting one on the bow.

Have you thought about going the extra battery route?

And like pyro says, are you sure the Kohler is not fixable?

 

[Dustin.In.DC]

I just want to be able to run the AC during the heat of the day. I’ve tested the Honda EU2200i Companion and it cranks the AC over without hesitation and after starting I have plenty left to run my battery charger as well. That genny has a 30A shore power inlet built into it making it perfect.

The Kohler needs a new lower unit at a minimum, I’ve had so many issues with it I just want reliability for this season and I’ll deal with that in the winter.

I plan to make a custom enclosure from ABS plastic to mount to the bow rail that will keep the genny out of the elements, ventilated and as cosmetically pleasing as possibly. ABS is easy material to cut and weld to make a nice custom enclosure. It will have a drain overboard in case there was a fluid leak.

 

[bahamabreisus]

Make sure your life insurance is paid up. I will leave it at that. I am certain others will chime in.

 

[Dustin.In.DC]

I just want to be able to run the AC during the heat of the day. I’ve tested the Power horse 2300 inverter gen from northern and it cranks the AC over without hesitation and after starting I have plenty left to run my battery charger as well. That genny has a 30A shore power inlet built into it making it ideal.

The Kohler needs a new lower unit at a minimum, I’ve had so many issues with it I just want reliability for this season and I’ll deal with that in the winter.

I plan to make a custom box to mount to the bow rail that will keep the genny out of the elements, ventilated and as cosmetically pleasing as possibly.

Make sure your life insurance is paid up. I will leave it at that. I am certain others will chime in.

You're right...running a 1980's technology lawnmower engine inside your engine bay ventilated thru hull is just the epitome of pure marine safety...who in their right mind would ever think of running a highly efficient 2021 Honda inverter on the forward bow of their vessel off the standard shore power inlet. How ignorant of me...

 

[Stee6043]

Ohh lordy. These threads normally show up in February!

You're clearly an expert on the difference between the marinzed and non-marinized gas engines so theres no need to debate that. I'd just add that if you're going to make questionable decisions, why not use the "least" questionable decision? Put it on the swim platform for crying out loud. Up on the bow just looks terrible and seems to have a higher probability of allowing exhaust back into the boat. But I'm no expert...

 

[Wanderer 290]

What year and size is your kohler. The engine probably a Kawasaki and most parts except the tapered crankshaft can be sourced through Kawasaki and often at a 50% savings.

 

[Creekwood]

Just fix your generator. As soon as it broke the value of your boat dropped by the generator repair or replacement cost you are trying to "save". You might as well pony up the cash to fix it right and enjoy the convenience of a properly installed and proven safe on board generator. You already lost the repair cost in value decline, but you don't get to enjoy the cost.

Your plan is you will do a lame band-aid solution on a nice boat, have all of the risks (and those risks are real) while you own it. And then when you sell, for most people looking to buy a boat, the fact that you would not repair something and find a cheap work-around is a huge red flag about what other maintenance or repair short cuts you will have taken. That will come into play when you decide to sell.

 

[Dustin.In.DC]

Just fix your generator. As soon as it broke the value of your boat dropped by the generator repair or replacement cost you are trying to "save". You might as well pony up the cash to fix it right and enjoy the convenience of a properly installed and proven safe on board generator. You already lost the repair cost in value decline, but you don't get to enjoy the cost.

Your plan is you will do a lame band-aid solution on a nice boat, have all of the risks (and those risks are real) while you own it. And then when you sell, for most people looking to buy a boat, the fact that you would not repair something and find a cheap work-around is a huge red flag about what other maintenance or repair short cuts you will have taken. That will come into play when you decide to sell.

Great point, certainly something I've considered. I just hate these gas generators, more people at the marina have problems with them than anything else. I've considered installing a diesel generator with a custom made poly tank to the stern of the starboard fuel tank but need something for short term and I do not want it on the swim platform where people will trip over it at raft ups and the CO concerns when it's placed there certainly seem larger than on the bow where it is 30' way from where everyone is.

 

[KevinC]

Great point, certainly something I've considered. I just hate these gas generators, more people at the marina have problems with them than anything else. I've considered installing a diesel generator with a custom made poly tank to the stern of the starboard fuel tank but need something for short term and I do not want it on the swim platform where people will trip over it at raft ups and the CO concerns when it's placed there certainly seem larger than on the bow where it is 30' way from where everyone is.

Why do you hate the gas generator? Most people have problems with them because they don't regularly use them leading to other issues. While it sucks having an issue with your own one - as commented before most of these can be repaired.

I think many people try to keep the hours down thinking they will save it's life span and keep the value high. Whenever someone tells me that the genset has very low hours I consider that a bad point knowing it was not run.

I have a nearly 20 yo Generac portable gas genny at home that I have beat the pants off and with regular maintenance just keeps going. There is a reason why the manufactures recommend regularly exercising these units.

-Kevin

 

[CaptRonn]

Great point, certainly something I've considered. I just hate these gas generators, more people at the marina have problems with them than anything else. I've considered installing a diesel generator with a custom made poly tank to the stern of the starboard fuel tank but need something for short term and I do not want it on the swim platform where people will trip over it at raft ups and the CO concerns when it's placed there certainly seem larger than on the bow where it is 30' way from where everyone is.

I installed a new Phasor 7.0 PMG diesel genset when my gas westerbeke ate itself. I installed a plastic fuel tank to fuel it (25 gallons) which gives about 48 hours of run time, far more than I need.

Totally happy with it.

 

[CaptRonn]

The death of any generator is infrequent use.

 

[Dustin.In.DC]

I installed a new Phasor 7.0 PMG diesel genset when my gas westerbeke ate itself. I installed a plastic fuel tank to fuel it (25 gallons) which gives about 48 hours of run time, far more than I need.

Totally happy with it.

This is the setup I'd like. The problem with the 320 V drive is space for the fuel tank. Pretty sure I need a custom poly tank placed to the stern of the starboard fuel tank.

 

[CaptRonn]

This is the setup I'd like. The problem with the 320 V drive is space for the fuel tank. Pretty sure I need a custom poly tank placed to the stern of the starboard fuel tank.

Custom poly tanks (what I have) can be made to any shape to fit a space. You will need to add a separate fuel fill and vent, and of course a diesel fuel filter in addition to the tank and genset.

For my purpose the 25 gallon works just fine. The Phasor at load burns about a 1/2 gallon per hour, and uses a Kubota engine running at 1800rpm. The Phasor unit is actually smaller than the westerbeke it replaced.

 

[Creekwood]

Great point, certainly something I've considered. I just hate these gas generators, more people at the marina have problems with them than anything else. I've considered installing a diesel generator with a custom made poly tank to the stern of the starboard fuel tank but need something for short term and I do not want it on the swim platform where people will trip over it at raft ups and the CO concerns when it's placed there certainly seem larger than on the bow where it is 30' way from where everyone is.

I would think there is more CO concern if its on the bow. CO drifts downwind. If you are bow into the breeze anchored, the worst place is the bow. I think people that have trouble with gas generators don't use them enough or don't do the basic required maintenance, particularly impeller changes.

 

[Blueone]

This should be a sticky...if its not already.

As only FrankW can explain:
↑
I posted this a couple of times in the past, but can’t seem to find it. These posts were in threads asking about portables and comparing them to permanent mount marine generators. I just don’t want to argue with folks who don’t seem grasp the total risk in using portables on boats. For me, its about understanding the risk, then making a smart decision, not about arguing ad infinitum on an internet forum. So here are the comments I posted but happened to save. Maybe they will answer your questions: (hope the formatting works)

Post #1: about portable generator risks-

1.Carbon Monoxide (CO) is present with all generators, but on portables, the exhaust is discharged at the generator, within an inch or so of the exhaust port on the cylinder. The exhaust system on a portable generator is usually constructed of non-marine alloys that can rust through after brief exposure to a salt water environment.ﰀ There is no engineered system to remove the exhaust from near occupied spaces. When placed on a swim platform, normal air flow can cause a station wagon effect and suck CO into the cockpit or cabin. While the same problem may exist with marine generators, the exhaust is mixed with cooling water and is discharged well away from occupied space at or near the waterline and is usually cleared by wind or sea breezes.


2. Fuel Systems on Honda's and other portables are vented to the atmosphere, not internally as with marine generator installations. That means explosive gasoline vapor is released at the generator, usually through a vent in the fuel fill cap. There is also the risk of a fuel spill if the generator is upset or you encounter rough seas or a large wake when the generator is close to full.

Their carburetors have a bowl drain that releases fuel inside the generator case. That means where you run it, store it or put it under way will have gasoline fumes released in the area and if the bowl drain leaks, you have raw fuel spilled.

Portable generators has simple fuel fittings and single ply fuel lines attached with hose clamps, both are substantial risks to fuel leakage if the generator isn’t new and has been around a while. Marine generators have USCG approved double ply braided fuel lines with swaged on end fittings that thread into the generator fuel pump.

3. Ignition Protection – None of the electrical components on portables are ignition protected. Marine generator electrical components are.

4. Shock Hazard Exposure –Portable generators pose an additional shock hazard since the portable is not grounded to the boat or to a shore side ground. Likely not a problem with a drill or power tool, but if you connect it to your boat's AC system, you have essentially disconnected the green wire. Yes, most portables sold today have 3-wire systems. Where the problem lies is that the portable generator is not part of the global ground when you plug in. When you plug into shore power you are also plugging into the ground for the entire local power system. When using a stationary mounted marine generator away from the dock, your boat is its own ground system. Even if the portable has GFI circuitry, they won’t work if there isn’t a continuous ground system. I think real risk here is that while the boat owner may understand grounding, not everyone on the boat….kids, wives, girl friends, helpful (?)guests…..usually don’t.

Additionally, most portable generators now use invertors. An inverter drives both line and neutral so it is possible to have voltage between neutral and ground. With ground bonded to the boat's bonding system, which mean to the water, this means a shock hazard may exist that normally should not.





Post #2: Its not about whose right or wrong, but about understanding the risks.

For me this whole discussion is not about who does what, how they try to suffocate themselves or blow themselves up, but it is about our responsibility as knowledgeable boaters to help others, who are not as experienced, learn from what is posted on CSR. Almost anything we do in life has some risk associated with it. Just because my car has 180 on the speedometer doesn't mean I drive that fast. Safe boating is all about fully understanding risk and avoiding all the risky behavior that you can.

When we advocate taking unnecessary risks, what kind of example are we setting for those who are new to the sport or who are non-technical and just want take their family boating?

However, I do get weary of these discussions turning into World War III when some of the more experienced CSR members take the time to answer an innocent question about using portable generators on boats with irrefutable facts. Because some of you have used portable generators and have not yet blown your ass off or asphyxiated your families does not make me wrong, elitist, stupid or corny, any more than it makes you right.

Honestly, I think part of the check and balance on the accuracy of the information contained on CSR is when the pros and cons on subjects like this are discussed. Those of us who feel that portable generators are inappropriate on boats would be negligent if we did not highlight the risks. I am also concerned enough about those risks that I would never agree with their use on a boat because of the potential liability.

And, for the record, I do own and regularly use a Honda EU series generator.......but the last place you will ever see it is on my boat.
Here is some interesting reading on this subject:

USCG warning Re: CO poisoning

http://www.doubleangel.org/documents...thFigures_.pdf


USCG circular 80

http://www.uscgboating.org/recalls/pdfs/BSC80.pdf


USCG circular 68

http://www.uscgboating.org/recalls/pdfs/bscscan68a.pdf


USCG Alert on CO from generator exhaust

http://www.uscgboating.org/alerts/alertsview.aspx?id=8


Data on CO deaths:

http://www.cpsc.gov/LIBRARY/portgen.pdf


http://www.uscgboating.org/recalls/pdfs/BSC74.pdf

Shows design and performance issues causing CO problems

 

[tdschafer]

I would think there is more CO concern if its on the bow. CO is heavier than air and drifts downwind. If you are bow into the breeze anchored, the worst place is the bow. I think people that have trouble with gas generators don't use them enough or don't do the basic required maintenance, particularly impeller changes.

I used to think the same thing until meeting with the town fire Marshall over a business expansion. The new prints showed the CO detectors on the ceiling which I thought was an issue. He stated that since CO & air were roughly the same weight it was no problem.

 

[Cocktail Time]

I have a friend that rebuilds Kohler gensets and has a few 7.3kw's and 5kw's ready to drop in with yours as a core. Very cost effective. If you are interested give him a call, Dave Lowery, 904-383-0963.